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Topic: This is encouraging< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2012, 12:21 pm  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

http://www.foxnews.com/politic....e-taxes

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"Asking liberals where wages and prices come from is like asking six-year-olds where babies come from."

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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2012, 12:34 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

LOL... you've been given your marching orders again.  This article is only a few hours old, and a quick search reveals (in the past few hours) it has been pasted all over the blogosphere, right on cue.  You do your masters' bidding well. :D

As for the article itself, I don't wholly disagree with the premise at the top, although it still fails by completely ignoring all the other regressive tax regimes most people do pay into.  But something for all brackets, even if 1%, I'd be fine with.  Guess what though, even at 1% or any percent, you still won't get your non-wage-earning retirees (i.e. nana and poppy) to pay income taxes, when they no longer earn an income.  No tweaking of %'s will bring the number of folks paying income tax to 100% when a growing share don't make income because they've retired.  Of course, the article fails to mention that, as did the survey.

However, regarding the survey numbers, it's interesting that they controlled the survey for age and race, but note that they didn't bother controlling it for party affiliation.  This is a Fox-News poll, keep in mind (who do you think is on their calling lists more often)?  Bound to get a skewed answer when you purposely don't bother controlling significant variables to avoid a skewed survey population.


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2012, 12:45 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

But that would be raising taxes! Master Grover wouldn't allow that.
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2012, 12:46 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(High_Sierra_Fan @ Sep. 28 2012, 10:45 am)
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Master Grover wouldn't allow that.

:laugh:

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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2012, 12:50 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The fact that BillBab finds ignorance* "encouraging" tells us a whole lot about him.


*Generally, about who isn't paying taxes, and why; more specifically, about how the EITC works, its purpose, and its practical impact.


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2012, 9:38 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Despite your long winded attempt at discrediting the poll the part I find encouraging is that so many americans (of whatever party)believe that a "fair share" means everyone paying something, rather than the approach of "Those people should pay more"

As I have always said, until everyone has "skin" in the income tax game there will be too many people willing to accept ever higher rates with very little return


And of course that only means everyone that has income


and it did ask enough party related questions to show a good sampling of Obama lovers even though it was not weighted by party...but heh...maybe Fox was trying to keep it generally non-partisan

Better men than you evidently

And I find it interesting that you would assume that more dems would have resulted in more people that do not think they should have to pay anything


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2012, 1:17 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

So: Pro raising taxes?

Good to know, the coming fiscal challenge will need the support.
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2012, 2:28 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

What I truly dislike about your "astroturfing", BillBab, is that you just throw this stuff out there, completely uncritically, then never read anything anyone else has to say.

I have posted this several times now since the "Romney video", so you should already have seen and understood.

The top 20% gets 66% of the tax expenditures (tax writeoffs: deductions, credits, etc.) while the bottom 80% only receives 34%. The top 1% get 24% of tax expenditures.

In short, "60% of the 47% are in the 1%". You should be able to remember that simple formulation.


So, what does this mean? It means that whatever percentage of folk exist out there "who want everyone to pay a fair share" are essentially saying that the upper income brackets need to have higher tax rates and fewer ways of getting out of paying anything at all.

Like Fox News, you seem to be implying that that is not the case. You seem to be implying that it's the bottom 20% who are "welfare queens", when it is, in fact, the top 20% who are "coasting".
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2012, 8:31 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I'm surprised to see that the majority of republicans believe they should pay federal taxes. Wonder why they spend so much time whining about them then? I'm even more surprised to hear the Bab say he considers that encouraging. Perhaps we're finally getting through to them that you have to pay people for their work.

Be interesting to know how much of that 79 percent actually pay federal income tax. Wonder how many of them would make the same statement if the pollster got specific and said, "Your aunt Mary lives off a meager retirement and social security and therefore pays no federal income tax. Do you believe this is fair?" Or, "Due to the fact that you have four kids, your wife is a stay at home mom, and you make an average salary, you get all your federal taxes refunded to you every year, which you then spend on a vacation for the family. Do you think you should stop receiving this refund?"

I suspect the results of the poll would have been different.
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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 02 2012, 11:40 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Once again we begin by creating the straw man and move on from there

The debate has never been about whether to pay taxes

It continues to be about the approach of

1. spending money we do not have
2. which creates a revenue shortage
3. Treating that shortage like a crisis that simply must be averted by increasing taxes (usually on "other people")

(It is the precipitating event approach and the public falls for it far too regularly)

And all the while acting like there is no other waste anywhere in the budget that could offset the results of that initial spending

It is about automatically increasing the budget of every program and department in the federal govt every year without evaluating their effectiveness.

About piling program on top of program

And always needing more money to pay for it all

And it is about a tax code that is designed s that the govt can reward certain groups at the expense of others instead of really sharing that sacrifice

So please stop pretending it is something different

We all believe in paying people for their work....some of us just want to see those people keep more of what they earned

good article here

http://www.usatoday.com/story....1604089

"With the likelihood of some sort of tax reform in the next four years, we should look to structure things in ways that discourage overspending, and over borrowing, by your elected leaders. Giving everyone some skin in the game might do that."


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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 02 2012, 11:54 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(BillBab @ Oct. 02 2012, 8:40 am)
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Once again we begin by creating the straw man and move on from there

The debate has never been about whether to pay taxes
......

Then you chose the WRONG article to link to?

Fox News poll: 79 percent say all Americans should pay income taxes

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politic....9pSN2AI
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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 02 2012, 12:04 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The "Inconvenient Math"

http://americanactionforum.org/sites....ath.pdf


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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 02 2012, 12:13 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(High_Sierra_Fan @ Oct. 02 2012, 11:54 am)
QUOTE

(BillBab @ Oct. 02 2012, 8:40 am)
QUOTE
Once again we begin by creating the straw man and move on from there

The debate has never been about whether to pay taxes
......

Then you chose the WRONG article to link to?

Fox News poll: 79 percent say all Americans should pay income taxes

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politic....9pSN2AI

I was referring to this statement

"I'm surprised to see that the majority of republicans believe they should pay federal taxes"

When the real missue is HOW MUCH they pay....not merely the question of IF they pay

Or does HG know some folks that do not pay fed income taxes but still "whine" about them?? :laugh:

But the majority of all parties now believe that EVERYONE should pay federal income taxes, which is still encouraging IMHO

Because the math is still inconvenient :)


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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 02 2012, 12:16 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Of course those taxes will be far higher when the bill comes due for the additional 4 Trillion in federal debt Romney/Ryan want to pile on our backs compared to current law as the Congressional Budget Office scored the Romney/Ryan budget the Republican's passed unanimously with zero Democratic caucus votes.

Oh and GE should be close to first on the list to step up and pay taxes. With free speech there's no free ride.
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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 02 2012, 12:19 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE


(BillBab @ Oct. 02 2012, 12:13 pm)
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Or does HG know some folks that do not pay fed income taxes but still "whine" about them??

You're probably foolish enough to believe that all these tea party types whining about taxes actually know what their tax liability is.
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