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Topic: Lead from hunter's bullets put Condors at risk< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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dayhiker9 Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 8:52 pm  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Story

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" before you make assertions about numbers, look at the numbers."   Krugman
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nogods Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 9:01 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Is that because West Nile virus isn't killing them due to the fact that they are being inoculated against it - just like mother nature would have done...?
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dayhiker9 Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 9:54 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

?

I doubt West Nile would be here except for mankind, or that the Condor would be endangered in the first place.

But I think you are right West Nile would have a large, maybe larger impact than lead.  Though I think the lead would keep killing while if a bird did survive West Nile its problems would be over as far as that disease goes.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 10:01 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Condors are ugly bastards, not that I'm wishing them dead or anything.

You wanna get worked up about human activity slaughtering innocent winged creatures?  Check out what wind power is doing to eagles and bats.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 10:55 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Good point, both are a problem.

Sounds like you don't care about Eagles either?


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 11:53 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Lead shot has come under fire for many years.  Steel shot is the way to go.  

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 17 2012, 12:51 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

of course the NRA disputes the research.  and reasonable regulation to protect the wildlife.

the west nile vaccines make sense for the captive raised birds.  There's such a genetic bottleneck in the population from those 20 birds in the 80's that the disease could kill off the entire species if those birds were not inoculated.  Obviously if they were able to get a self-sustaining wild population going, they would eventually have to stop inoculating the birds.

this is a classic case of bioaccumulation.  I have some friends/coworkers who are doing research about lead shot right now.  even though it's banned for bird hunting, it's still a problem.  it was permitted for so long that some areas that had high hunting pressure have pretty substantial amounts of lead in the soil...and the birds consume it and they still get lead poisoning.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 17 2012, 9:53 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

You can still use shot for upland game in the condor area.   Look it up.  Lead sinkers are still allowed for fishing as well.

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 17 2012, 9:57 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Direct metallurgical evidence links to bullet fragments in larger game carcasses.
California Department of Fish and Game No Lead page;
http://www.dfg.ca.gov/wildlife/hunting/condor/


http://www.ventanaws.org/species_condors_lead/
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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 18 2012, 9:47 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

NRA will fight this to the last man....I mean, last bird.

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 18 2012, 9:56 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The world that favored the large soaring scavengers has passed. The megafauna are mostly extinct, with the largest cervid (moose) struggling, bovid (bison) barely saved, and the largest predators extirpated from the CA Condors range. The gene pool has been through a severe bottleneck event and there are plenty of toxins that we throw into the mix that are biomagnified; PCB's, organophosphates, mercury, lead. Todays ecosystems favor vultures that can make use of smaller, less toxic carcasses.

Having said that, I think that sports like hunting and fishing should not be putting so much lead into the environment.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 18 2012, 10:18 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I am constantly amazed by the stubborn denial of some in the Hunting and Fishing Communities. Just like I think ATV and Dirt Bike Manufacturers should have PR campaigns about responsible riders not going off trails and tearing up terrain I would think ammunition manufacturers would want a better image too.

But just like ATV manufacturers know tearing up terrain is the image many prospects love I guess ammuntion manufacturers know that their customers want the deadliest ammunition they can get.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 18 2012, 12:23 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

U-238, the ammo that kills and kills and kills!

I could be a mad man, don't you think?


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 18 2012, 2:08 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

There are non toxic rifle bullets available today that perfom as well as lead.

I shoot the barnes TTSX bullet, it's metal is 99.97% copper.

It's one badass round compared to lead or any other metal.

Options do exist.

http://cartridgecomparisonguide.blogspot.com/2010....tml?m=1
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Tacksman Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 18 2012, 3:53 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE

Barnes makes terrific ammo. I for one use VOR-TX. Dont get me wrong, i love to hike, but i also love all of God's creatures, next to my mash potato's...

Opinions vary.


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14 replies since Nov. 16 2012, 8:52 pm < Next Oldest | Next Newest >

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