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Topic: VooDoo economics: staked through the heart.< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 28 2012, 1:22 am  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

By the Congressional Research Service

In part concluding:
"The results of the analysis in this report suggest that changes over the past 65 years in the top marginal tax rate and the top capital gains tax rate do not appear correlated with economic growth. The reduction in the top statutory tax rates appears to be uncorrelated with saving, investment, and productivity growth. The top tax rates appear to have little or no relation to the size of the economic pie. But as a small proportion of taxpayers are affected by changes in the top statutory tax rates, this finding is not unexpected.

However, the top tax rate reductions appear to be correlated with the increasing concentration of income at the top of the income distribution. As measured by IRS data, the share of income accruing to the top 0.1% of U.S. families increased from 4.2% in 1945 to 12.3% by 2007 before falling to 9.2% due to the 2007-2009 recession. At the same time, the average tax rate paid by the top 0.1% fell from over 50% in 1945 to about 25% in 2009. The statistical analysis in this report suggests that tax policy could be related to how the economic pie is sliced—lower top tax rates may be associated with greater income disparities."

Former President George H. W. Bush will no doubt feel vindicated for his prescience in so deriding "Reaganomics".
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 28 2012, 7:51 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Did they get to the part where taking all the money from "the rich" will not pay for our current spending levels for more than about a week?

That is where the math really meets the road


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 28 2012, 11:22 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(BillBab @ Dec. 28 2012, 7:51 am)
QUOTE
Did they get to the part where taking all the money from "the rich" will not pay for our current spending levels for more than about a week?

That is where the math really meets the road

Income inequality be damned, if there's a way to help the economy in the long run and it doesn't have an obvious short term impact for the masses of the uninformed to see plainly in front of them, well then screw it...let's just continue on the path of the last 13 years or so which has clearly worked so well...

:sigh: sometimes its not about the math "next week" BillBab, sometimes we have to think far in advance, like even years in advance...


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 28 2012, 11:55 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

What income inequality has given us is economic volatility.  

When you give away such vast sums to the rich, they do not run out and create jobs just for giggles.  They stash some in the Cayman Islands and then they speculate with the rest.  Speculate on things like...hare-brained dot-coms and mortgage-based derivatives.  And this is how we get recessions.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 28 2012, 12:17 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(BillBab @ Dec. 28 2012, 7:51 am)
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Did they get to the part where taking all the money from "the rich" will not pay for our current spending levels for more than about a week?

That is where the math really meets the road

Did you get to the part where you source your claim?

Did you get to the part where the goal was to have no deficit?

Did you get to the part where deficits are far and away the norm the past 150 years?

Did you get to the part where surpluses have been very very rare the past 150 years?


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 28 2012, 12:31 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(orygawn @ Dec. 28 2012, 9:55 am)
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What income inequality has given us is economic volatility.  

When you give away such vast sums to the rich, they do not run out and create jobs just for giggles.  They stash some in the Cayman Islands and then they speculate with the rest.  Speculate on things like...hare-brained dot-coms and mortgage-based derivatives.  And this is how we get recessions.

On top of that, most of the wealthy invest in preferred stocks with huge stable dividends (fixed unlike common stock dividends).  They get their payoff unless there's a huge recession or high inflation.  Kind of makes sense they don't want much to change when you think about it.  I wouldn't say this is job creation as most of these preferred stocks are on a secondary market, more of an extraction if unemployment is rising.  My info is about 2 years old but there were similar articles since I've been following personal finance since 1990.

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 28 2012, 7:32 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Is it really so simple?

OTOH, yes, we need to acknowledge the big problem of our widening income inequality.

OTOH, y'all also need to look at our overall economic performance over the last two or three decades -- yes, "voodoo" economics since the 1980's.

1.  Compare how far we've come economically versus Japan.  We've got problems, but our economy seems so much more dynamic than Japan's!  Voodoo economics?

2.  Compare how far we've come economically versus EU -- excepting maybe Britain -- which actually blazed the path of "voodoo" economics for us.  Thatcherism predated (and was actually the catalyst for) Reagonomics.

No good to just focus on the bad.


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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 22 2013, 9:18 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Given the Ryan drivel were going to need a bigger stake!*


* Jaws homage.
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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 11:23 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Britain's austerity program has locked their economy in a recession, while ours has grown slowly. Give Ryan control over the economy and we will be back in the cellar again. Yes, it is Voodoo Economics. All of that money offshore in the Cayman Islands is not circulating in our economy. Concentrating wealth does little for the velocity of money in our economy.

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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 11:34 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

And, deregulation that started in earnest under Reagan and continued, with Clinton and the repeal of Glass/Steagall, is good for big business and the wealthy, but not so much for the average American. Regulations, by in large, established during Roosevelt's administration, correcting the ills of big business through the industrial revolution period.

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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 11:39 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

These are the 35 things the Dems have given the middle and lower class.

John's 35 Reasons To Appreciate The Democratic Party - With All Their Faults  1) Democrats Fought for Social Security (F.D.R.)
2) Democrats Fought for Medicare (L.B.J.)
3) Democrats Fought for Medicaid (L.B.J.)
4) Democrats Fought for Welfare Benefits (F.D.R.)
5) Democrats Fought for Civil Rights (L.B.J.)
6) Democrats Fought for Unemployment Insurance (F.D.R.)
7) Democrats Fought for National Labor Relations Board (F.D.R.)
8) Democrats Fought for 8 Hour Work Day-5 Day Work Week- Work Place Breaks & Overtime Pay (F.D.R.)
9) Democrats Fought for Workers Compensation (Woodrow Wilson)
10) Democrats Fought for Americans with Disability Act (101st Democratic Congress - over G.H.W. Bush veto)
11) Democrats Fought for Holiday Pay(F.D.R.)
12) Democrats Fought for Medical Leave Act (Bill Clinton)
13) Democrats Fought for Prevention of Child Labor (F.D.R.)
14) Democrats Fought for Minimum Wage Act (F.D.R.)
15) Democrats Fought for Work Place Safety (OSHA) *** (Nixon)
16) Democrats Fought for Affirmative Action as it relates to Racial Discrimination (J.F.K)
17) Democrats Fought for Women's Rights (L.B.J)
18) Democrats Fought for Tax Fairness (Platform Issue)
19) Democrats Fought for Veterans Pay & Benefits (F.D.R.)
20) Democrats Fought for Consumer Protection / Consumer Bill of Rights (J.F.K.)
21) Democrats Fought for Gun Law's / Background Checks to prevent felons from getting Weapons (L.B.J) (B.Clinton)
22) Democrats Fought for Credit Card Holders Bill of Rights (Barack Obama)
23) Democrats Fought for Funding Our Schools (L.B.J.)
24) Democrats Fought for Grants for low income people to attend college (L.B.J.)
25) Democrats Fought for Environmental Regulations - Clean Water Act / Clean Air Act (Dems Override Nixon Veto)
26) Democrats Fought for Financial Regulations keeping Wall Street Wizards Accountable (Dodd/Frank - Obama)
27) Democrats Fought for Affordable Health Care for Everyone (Obama Care)
28) Democrats Fought for Hate Crime Legislation (Matthew Shepard) (Barack Obama)
29) Democrats Fought for Children's Health Legislation for 11 Million Children without Health Care (Barack Obama)
30) Democrats Fought for Voting Rights Act (L.B.J)
31) Democrats Fought for National Voter Registration (Bill Clinton)
32) Democrats Fought for Largest Deficit Cutting Plan in History (Bill Clinton)
33) Democrats Fought for Clayton Anti-Trust Act (Woodrow Wilson)
34) Democrats Fought for Securities & Exchange Act (Franklin D. Roosevelt)
35) Democrats Fought for National School Lunch Program (Harry Truman)


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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 10:46 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Careful there Monte, someone will confuse you for a big government, big spending liberal  :laugh:

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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 10:54 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Those of us who lived through the Reagan/Bush years and thought we were experiencing economic recovery and prosperity were only buying into the manipulation by the conservative ABC, NBC and CBS media ha ha ha! :)

The exploding budgets were Reagans of course, Tip and the Dems had nothing to do with it because congress has nothing to do with budgets :)

Of course the conservative congress under Newt didn't have anything to do with budgets (like the congress has anything to do with budgets!) that's why Clinton was able to do get his spending so in line! Ha ha ha :)

You guys crack me up!

A pox on both side of the aisle.


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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 10:58 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Ha, yeah. I appreciate most all of those things though actually. And I know you are libertarian, which is cool too. I think it's good for government to get in there and help when it's needed and stay out of the way when the people are making it happen. I realise that that is probably somewhat of a difficult order. Say, did YOU just call me a big government, big spending liberal?

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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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PostIcon Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 11:01 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE

Nice Ron. Be more overt, I'm interested.

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