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Topic: I Find This Troubling...< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
 Post Number: 1
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 23 2013, 1:15 pm  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I am not into conspiracy theories and such... and I do feel like I am living free and all that...  but when I read that our government leads the world in requests for users' Google data, I wonder just what is going on in the background, day in and day out?  Nothing happens when we keep to our daily routine -- but what if we decide to "stick our heads up" one day?  Will our government have  a pretty comprehensive 'dossier' of us handy -- to use against us when need be?

IMO, it would be foolish if our government didn't use modern technology and resources to fight crime and all that -- but really, the highest requester of info. among all the governments in the world?  Too much snooping?

Read more here.


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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page.  -- St. Augustine
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 23 2013, 1:23 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The September 11, 2001 attacks really spooked them. Getting a collection of mundane things to seek out ominous patterns is one direction they've since been exploring.

Possibly they're the highest requestors because there are regulations in place that a request must be processed: rather than the government being simply wired into the data...
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 23 2013, 1:30 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

There are rumblings that Google and the government are...uh hum...err....the same. Kinda like the illuminati, who shot JR and rock candy conspiracies.
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 23 2013, 1:46 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

As noted, we have to file warrents.  I'd also suspect that in many countries where the state keeps a tight watch on things, they don't permit open access to google or the internet in general.

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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 23 2013, 1:56 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I wonder just how easy it is to get warrants?  Obviously, much depends on the cases themselves, as well as the individual personalities of both prosecutors and judges.

Is it more costly to refuse a warrant -- only later to find out the suspect killed yet more people while staying free -- or just issue the damn warrants?  Simplistic, I know, but I think it is a valid question:   what is more costly to the career of judges -- failure to help bring criminals to justice -- or causing some false positives and "inconveniences" to select individuals?


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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 23 2013, 2:06 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Whatever "quality control" there is has more to do with bad people getting cases tossed because the warrant was trash I'd expect.

Which, in it's way, would be failure to help bring a criminal to justice....
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 23 2013, 2:14 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(High_Sierra_Fan @ Jan. 23 2013, 11:06 am)
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Whatever "quality control" there is has more to do with bad people getting cases tossed because the warrant was trash I'd expect.

Which, in it's way, would be failure to help bring a criminal to justice....

That's one mitigating factor.

I don't see the courts and the police as "adversarial" -- no, not at all -- but it is good to have checks and balances, regardless of the people involved.


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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 27 2013, 1:46 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Now, I read that Google's "Transparency Report" isn't transparent at all.  Google is already reporting that our government requests more user info than any other in the world.  And yet...

"Google's transparency reports do not include requests for user data made by the government under the U.S. Patriot Act, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Amendment Act or through the use of National Security Letters (NSLs). Most of the requests made via these statutes are tied to national security issues and often compel providers to disclose far more data than ECPA subpoenas and court orders permit."

Imagine Google providing more user data to the Chinese government than any other -- and then EXCLUDING many of those requests from its reports!!

Source:  PC World.


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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 27 2013, 5:43 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Probably should make the cooperative gesture and send a "Freind" request to the NSA? Or would that be redundant?
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 28 2013, 7:06 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(JimInMD @ Jan. 23 2013, 1:46 pm)
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As noted, we have to file warrents.  I'd also suspect that in many countries where the state keeps a tight watch on things, they don't permit open access to google or the internet in general.

Jim, can you tell us more about the warrant process?

Can you still collect the information without a warrant but just not present the evidence in court without it?

Couldn't google just agree to give you access to it's records?

My perspective is ISP's are just that and a legal fight over records cost them money.  Wouldn't google just turn over the records?


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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 28 2013, 7:25 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Warrents at that level are not something I'm going to deal with, so I can't shed much light.  Like so many other things in police work, I suppose an investigator can ask for whatever they want, compelling cooperation requires a warrent.  I suppose that if Google decided that they'd answer any question from any cop, they'd be within their rights to do so.

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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 28 2013, 12:19 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

"if Google decided that they'd answer any question from any cop, they'd be within their rights to do so."

They might be restricted by their terms of service though. Probably somehting on that at the Electronic Freedom Foundation...
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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 28 2013, 12:29 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(JimInMD @ Jan. 28 2013, 4:25 am)
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Warrents at that level are not something I'm going to deal with, so I can't shed much light.  Like so many other things in police work, I suppose an investigator can ask for whatever they want, compelling cooperation requires a warrent.  I suppose that if Google decided that they'd answer any question from any cop, they'd be within their rights to do so.

The role of the courts is one important safeguard -- although much depends on individual judges.  I really hope Google doesn't just answer cop / investigator questions or provide info without warrants!!

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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 28 2013, 12:31 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Ben2World @ Jan. 28 2013, 12:29 pm)
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(JimInMD @ Jan. 28 2013, 4:25 am)
QUOTE
Warrents at that level are not something I'm going to deal with, so I can't shed much light.  Like so many other things in police work, I suppose an investigator can ask for whatever they want, compelling cooperation requires a warrent.  I suppose that if Google decided that they'd answer any question from any cop, they'd be within their rights to do so.

The role of the courts is one important safeguard -- although much depends on individual judges.  I really hope Google doesn't just answer cop / investigator questions or provide info without warrants!!

I would agree.

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PostIcon Posted on: Jan. 28 2013, 4:00 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE

More info. re. Google's general compliance approach:

"Here's a rundown of that process, according to Drummond (Google's Chief Legal Officer):

"Google scrutinizes the request carefully to make sure it's legal and complies with Google's policies. To consider complying, a request typically must be made in writing, signed by an authorized official, and issued under an appropriate law.

Google evaluates the scope of the request. If it's too broad, it may refuse to provide the information or seek to narrow the request. Drummond noted Google does this frequently.

Google notifies users about legal demand when appropriate. Sometimes it can't, either because it's legally prohibited or because it doesn't have a user's verified contact information.

Google requires that government agencies conducting criminal investigations use a search warrant to compel it to provide a user's search query information and private content stored in a Google account, like Gmail messages, documents, photos, and YouTube videos."


Source:  CNET.


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