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Ben2World 
Group: Members
Posts: 23925
Joined: Jun. 2005
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Posted on: Jan. 31 2013, 8:38 pm |
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If I ran the NRA -- not only would I not fight against gun control laws -- I would champion them so that my organization would be the driving force (and not the reactionary force) to ensuring responsible gun ownership. To me, that would be the best way to ensure national support for continued gun ownership!
But instead, I see the powerful NRA the same as the formerly-powerful Tobacco Institute! TI used to be feared by everyone. And instead of being the driving force to ensure responsible tobacco production, selling and consumption -- it used its vast power and influence to stymie all efforts at reform! It took decades -- but when the voting public finally overwhelmed the TI and its lobbyists -- the tide turned so relentlessly that smokers are now treated little better than rats in public areas!!
Unless the NRA changes tactics -- I see it going the same way as the Tobacco Institute. Back 30 years ago, few could imagine fighting the TI and winning -- but that was what happened exactly.
Sorry for the off-topic rant.
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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buddero
Group: Members
Posts: 777
Joined: Jan. 2009
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Posted on: Jan. 31 2013, 9:12 pm |
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(Ben2World @ Jan. 31 2013, 8:38 pm)
QUOTE If I ran the NRA -- not only would I not fight against gun control laws -- I would champion them so that my organization would be the driving force (and not the reactionary force) to ensuring responsible gun ownership. To me, that would be the best way to ensure national support for continued gun ownership!
But instead, I see the powerful NRA the same as the formerly-powerful Tobacco Institute! TI used to be feared by everyone. And instead of being the driving force to ensure responsible tobacco production, selling and consumption -- it used its vast power and influence to stymie all efforts at reform! It took decades -- but when the voting public finally overwhelmed the TI and its lobbyists -- the tide turned so relentlessly that smokers are now treated little better than rats in public areas!!
Unless the NRA changes tactics -- I see it going the same way as the Tobacco Institute. Back 30 years ago, few could imagine fighting the TI and winning -- but that was what happened exactly.
Sorry for the off-topic rant.
Hahahahahahaha. Me too. I hope you're right about the NRA and TI. But I think the 2nd Amendment has more passionate supporters than tobacco.
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Reach out your hand, if your cup be empty
If your cup is full, may it be again
Journal and links to refugees, backpacking, travel in Asia, photos, honky-tonk angels, other beautiful things...
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Montecresto
Group: Members
Posts: 1874
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Jan. 31 2013, 11:50 pm |
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Well yeah, Tobacco has no amendment but arms, and the RIGHT to bear them does.
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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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markinOhio
Group: Members
Posts: 354
Joined: Feb. 2005
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Posted on: Feb. 01 2013, 7:29 am |
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I do not agree with the NRA’s hard nose stance on regulating the private sale of firearms, and I agree that it will ultimately be counterproductive in maintaining gun ownership rights. However, I understand that it is a function of the extremism on the part of the anti-gun lobby, and the pattern of progressive erosion of 2nd Amendment rights. Further, unlike the TI, the NRA is a private organization that represents members. Although demonized as an organization that solely represents the concerns of the gun industry, their support of private gun sales is actually evidence to the contrary.
Just few technical points:
1) The guns were not illegal
2) This was not an example of the “gun show loophole” (simply evidenced by the fact that he was in fact charged with a crime). His crime was dealing firearms without a license.
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Montecresto
Group: Members
Posts: 1874
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Feb. 01 2013, 7:58 am |
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People kill. Are you also advocating banning tobacco because of its health effects. Where might that logic lead us too. By now only smokers living under rocks are unaware of the health risks. Should we ban 32 oz. cokes as well?
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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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BillBab
Group: Members
Posts: 4500
Joined: Sep. 2008
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Posted on: Feb. 01 2013, 8:50 am |
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What I find most annoying is that this guy only faces a maximum of five years
But Mark is correct
It was legal for this guy to buy the weapons....he went through an FFL
If it was one rifle it would still be legal for him to sell it to someone else
But this bozo was trying to be a gun dealer without the licensing
Be interesting to see if any of the weapons ever turn up in a crime. The assumption by the anti gun crowd is that they simply MUST have been sold to criminals and terrorists
A universal background check law would only have inflated his prices !
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"Asking liberals where wages and prices come from is like asking six-year-olds where babies come from."
Thomas Sowell
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gunslinger
Group: Members
Posts: 6032
Joined: Mar. 2007
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Posted on: Feb. 01 2013, 4:42 pm |
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I'm of the opinion that the term gun dealer is not clearly defined.
One point I can agree on would be to clearly define what constitutes a dealer and what constitutes a collector etc.
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For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
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Land Rover
Group: Members
Posts: 6529
Joined: Sep. 2006
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Posted on: Feb. 01 2013, 6:26 pm |
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(HighGravity @ Feb. 01 2013, 5:08 pm)
QUOTE
(BillBab @ Feb. 01 2013, 8:59 am)
QUOTE The NRA has always come down firmly on the side of keeping weapons out of the hands of criminals and crazies. Could you give us some specifics on how they've done that?
I think that involves opposing any sort of gun regulations ever and using their lobbying power to roll back and eliminate what gun laws are already on the books.
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Bass
Group: Members
Posts: 1536
Joined: Sep. 2006
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Posted on: Feb. 02 2013, 9:39 am |
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(Land Rover @ Feb. 01 2013, 5:26 pm)
QUOTE
(HighGravity @ Feb. 01 2013, 5:08 pm)
QUOTE
(BillBab @ Feb. 01 2013, 8:59 am)
QUOTE The NRA has always come down firmly on the side of keeping weapons out of the hands of criminals and crazies. Could you give us some specifics on how they've done that? I think that involves opposing any sort of gun regulations ever and using their lobbying power to roll back and eliminate what gun laws are already on the books.
It looks like the NRA wants to make it harder for people judged to be mentally ill to slip through the cracks in the existing background check system. So maybe they are listening to the rest of the country's call to ban guns and are ready to start giving in a little on their hard stance.
NRA on Background Checks
On Thursday, NRA president David Keane said the group supported measures to fine-tune the current system used by licensed gun dealers, and the inclusion in that system of people judged to be mentally ill.
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| Post Number: 14
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Montecresto
Group: Members
Posts: 1874
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Feb. 02 2013, 9:44 am |
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They ought to insist on laying down the guidelines on what constitutes mentally ill and who will be certifying before agreeing.
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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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Montecresto
Group: Members
Posts: 1874
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Feb. 02 2013, 10:29 am |
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What are your qualifications for diagnosing psychosis? And of anonymous individuals on the net no less. You are a hoot.
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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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HighGravity
Group: Members
Posts: 2348
Joined: Oct. 2009
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Posted on: Feb. 02 2013, 11:21 am |
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I didn't diagnose you. I'm stating facts. Paranoid delusions are a symptom of psychosis. My point is that you keep referring to the mentally ill and you don't seem to realize how difficult it is for people to properly diagnosed. Depression is a mental illness. Are your ready to disarm everyone who is depressed?
You keep bashing psychotropic drugs which are necessary for many people to keep their symptoms in check so you're speaking out of both sides of your mouth. You oppose measures to treat mental illness yet you keep blaming mental illness for gun deaths even though very few can be attributed to that.
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HighGravity
Group: Members
Posts: 2348
Joined: Oct. 2009
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Posted on: Feb. 02 2013, 11:25 am |
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AR-15's are one of many things used to commit violence. Are you not aware of that?
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| Post Number: 20
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markinOhio
Group: Members
Posts: 354
Joined: Feb. 2005
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Posted on: Feb. 02 2013, 11:35 am |
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I am aware of the extreme rarity of AR-15’s to be used in acts of violence.
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| Post Number: 21
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HighGravity
Group: Members
Posts: 2348
Joined: Oct. 2009
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Posted on: Feb. 02 2013, 12:18 pm |
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Are you aware that they are made for the purpose of killing people?
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| Post Number: 22
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Survival Skills 101 • Eat Better
