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Buggyboo 
Group: Members
Posts: 1137
Joined: Feb. 2013
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 9:48 pm |
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Old Bloomy, if it's not your soda cup size, it's your congressman he's telling you that you have to have;
http://www.politico.com/story....50.html
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"I'll give you my gun when you pry it from my cold, dead hands"
Charlton Heston
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| Post Number: 2
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Ben2World
Group: Members
Posts: 23918
Joined: Jun. 2005
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 9:51 pm |
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Be fair, Buggyboo. Imagine how much harder the NRA would have to struggle if it couldn't buy our government!?! 
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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| Post Number: 3
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Buggyboo
Group: Members
Posts: 1137
Joined: Feb. 2013
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 10:07 pm |
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(Ben2World @ Mar. 20 2013, 9:51 pm)
QUOTE Be fair, Buggyboo. Imagine how much harder the NRA would have to struggle if it couldn't buy our government!?!
Is the comparison fair?
NRA is made up of millions of people.
"According to published statements,[1] the NRA's total income for 2011 was $218,983,530, with total expenditures of $231,071,589. In 2010, the organization reported an income of $227.8 million with roughly $115 million in revenue generated from fundraising, sales, advertising and royalties, with the remainder originating from membership dues"
Bloomburg is one individual with a 27 Billion dollar fortune.
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"I'll give you my gun when you pry it from my cold, dead hands"
Charlton Heston
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Ron.
don't surround yourself with your self
Group: Members
Posts: 11944
Joined: Sep. 2006
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 10:27 pm |
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Between the NRA and Bloomberg, only one has used coercive power to impose their will on others.
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And be kind toward one another
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| Post Number: 6
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Ron.
don't surround yourself with your self
Group: Members
Posts: 11944
Joined: Sep. 2006
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 10:35 pm |
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(Land Rover @ Mar. 20 2013, 9:29 pm)
QUOTE
(Ron. @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:27 pm)
QUOTE Between the NRA and Bloomberg, only one has used coercive power to impose their will on others. No, it's really is both of them. Thank goodness we have those conservatives in the Supreme Court making sure we will never find out who is spending what.
Well we know Bloomberg uses his wealth and position to push legislation through, then has the police power as his muscle. Do what I say, or else.
In what manner has the NRA used violence to achieve their goals?
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And be kind toward one another
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| Post Number: 8
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Land Rover
Group: Members
Posts: 6529
Joined: Sep. 2006
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 10:38 pm |
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(Ron. @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:35 pm)
QUOTE
(Land Rover @ Mar. 20 2013, 9:29 pm)
QUOTE
(Ron. @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:27 pm)
QUOTE Between the NRA and Bloomberg, only one has used coercive power to impose their will on others. No, it's really is both of them. Thank goodness we have those conservatives in the Supreme Court making sure we will never find out who is spending what. Well we know Bloomberg uses his wealth and position to push legislation through, then has the police power as his muscle. Do what I say, or else. In what manner has the NRA used violence to achieve their goals?
Violence - sorry Ron, what you smoking there? You libertarians....
Coercive power. NRA uses money to influence the US political process. It's become the reason for its existence.
You understand what lobbying is right?
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| Post Number: 9
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Ron.
don't surround yourself with your self
Group: Members
Posts: 11944
Joined: Sep. 2006
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 10:57 pm |
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Here in Illinois they are still trying to outlaw some particular guns and accessories.
If they succeed in making them illegal and I were to refuse to turn in my now illegal gun, men with guns will come and use violence to take me away.
That is what a law is, "do it or else".
If you continue to refuse to pay a parking ticket, it is not inconceivable that you can be taken away by force by the police, ie arrested. Laws carry the implicit threat of force being used against you if you disobey.
It really isn't that esoteric or particularly libertarian to acknowledge that reality. What is libertarian is questioning the morality of being buried under mountains of laws and regulations.
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And be kind toward one another
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| Post Number: 10
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Ben2World
Group: Members
Posts: 23918
Joined: Jun. 2005
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 10:59 pm |
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Ron:
Bloomberg strikes me as heavy handed (e.g. his soda law) but hardly of a violent nature??
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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| Post Number: 11
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Ben2World
Group: Members
Posts: 23918
Joined: Jun. 2005
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Posted on: Mar. 20 2013, 11:10 pm |
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(Ron. @ Mar. 20 2013, 8:08 pm)
QUOTE
(Ben2World @ Mar. 20 2013, 9:59 pm)
QUOTE Ron:
Bloomberg strikes me as heavy handed (e.g. his soda law) but hardly of a violent nature?? Lets say his soda law stood and it became law. If an establishment continually refused to serve smaller servings and refused to pay the fines eventually guys with guns would be involved. Taking away the owner, being used as deterrent muscle while the health dept chains the doors shut, there would be a show of force. The use of the state to impose your will, even benevolently is a form of violence. That is why the redress of grievances is in the constitution, the founders understood the coercive nature of law.
All true, but that apply to laws in general, not just Bloomberg's?
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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Montecresto
Group: Members
Posts: 1874
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Mar. 21 2013, 2:59 am |
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(Land Rover @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:38 pm)
QUOTE
(Ron. @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:35 pm)
QUOTE
(Land Rover @ Mar. 20 2013, 9:29 pm)
QUOTE
(Ron. @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:27 pm)
QUOTE Between the NRA and Bloomberg, only one has used coercive power to impose their will on others. No, it's really is both of them. Thank goodness we have those conservatives in the Supreme Court making sure we will never find out who is spending what. Well we know Bloomberg uses his wealth and position to push legislation through, then has the police power as his muscle. Do what I say, or else. In what manner has the NRA used violence to achieve their goals? Violence - sorry Ron, what you smoking there? You libertarians.... Coercive power. NRA uses money to influence the US political process. It's become the reason for its existence. You understand what lobbying is right?
All special interest groups use money to influence their will. Why just point at the NRA?
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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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Ben2World
Group: Members
Posts: 23918
Joined: Jun. 2005
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Posted on: Mar. 21 2013, 3:09 am |
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(Montecresto @ Mar. 21 2013, 12:02 am)
QUOTE
(Ben2World @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:59 pm)
QUOTE Ron:
Bloomberg strikes me as heavy handed (e.g. his soda law) but hardly of a violent nature?? In fairness bud, Ron didn't use the word violent. But if you can enforce your will............
Monte:
See Ron's post no. 11: "The use of the state to impose your will, even benevolently is a form of violence".
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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| Post Number: 16
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Montecresto
Group: Members
Posts: 1874
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Mar. 21 2013, 3:19 am |
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Your right, I missed that. Are you on the night shift, lol?
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Killing one person is murder, killing a 100,000 is foreign policy
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| Post Number: 17
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Ron.
don't surround yourself with your self
Group: Members
Posts: 11944
Joined: Sep. 2006
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Posted on: Mar. 21 2013, 8:45 am |
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(Ben2World @ Mar. 20 2013, 10:10 pm)
QUOTE
(Ron. @ Mar. 20 2013, 8:08 pm)
QUOTE
(Ben2World @ Mar. 20 2013, 9:59 pm)
QUOTE Ron:
Bloomberg strikes me as heavy handed (e.g. his soda law) but hardly of a violent nature?? Lets say his soda law stood and it became law. If an establishment continually refused to serve smaller servings and refused to pay the fines eventually guys with guns would be involved. Taking away the owner, being used as deterrent muscle while the health dept chains the doors shut, there would be a show of force. The use of the state to impose your will, even benevolently is a form of violence. That is why the redress of grievances is in the constitution, the founders understood the coercive nature of law. All true, but that apply to laws in general, not just Bloomberg's?
That is my point precisely Ben.
The founders understood that and constructed a constitution that limited government and went to great lengths to insure the peoples rights were preserved.
Unfortunately a constitution cannot preserve the liberty of a people who are hell bent on trading away liberty for supposed security.
Whenever someone starts advocating the changing of laws I like to ask myself; is anyones life, liberty or property being infringed upon by this new legislation?
It truly is amazing how so many people want to run other peoples lives.
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And be kind toward one another
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Buggyboo
Group: Members
Posts: 1137
Joined: Feb. 2013
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Posted on: Mar. 23 2013, 9:56 pm |
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And the beat goes on or he just wrote another check;
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo....ongress
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"I'll give you my gun when you pry it from my cold, dead hands"
Charlton Heston
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Survival Skills 101 • Eat Better
