SUBSCRIBE | NEWSLETTERS | MAPS | VIDEOS | BLOGS | MARKETPLACE | CONTESTS
TRY BACKPACKER FREE!
SUBSCRIBE NOW and get
2 Free Issues and 3 Free Gifts!
Full Name:
Address 1:
Address 2:
City:
State:
Zip Code:
Email: (required)
If I like it and decide to continue, I'll pay just $12.00, and receive a full one-year subscription (9 issues in all), a 73% savings off the newsstand price! If for any reason I decide not to continue, I'll write "cancel" on the invoice and owe nothing.
Your subscription includes 3 FREE downloadable booklets.
Or click here to pay now and get 2 extra issues
Offer valid in US only.


» Welcome Guest
[ Log In :: Register ]

Page 1 of 212>>

[ Track This Topic :: Email This Topic :: Print this topic ]

reply to topic new topic new poll
Topic: Boycott Florida, Until Self Defense Laws Changed< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
 Post Number: 1
Bass Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 2118
Joined: Sep. 2006
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 7:25 am  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Boycott Florida

Jesse Jackson advocates to "isolate Florida as a kind of apartheid state..." until the self defense justification and stand your ground laws are changed.

Jackson says that Florida's law is responsible for homicides against black tripling.

The heat will rise until President Obama provides the moral leadership and directs that Zimmerman be retried.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 2
Lamebeaver Search for posts by this member.
trail? I don't need no stinkin trail!
Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 18990
Joined: Aug. 2004
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 7:30 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Red Herring - Zimmerman did not use "Stand your Ground" as part of his defense.

I don't believe Obama has the right to demand a retrial. The judge would have to determine the jury ignored their instructions in order to throw out the verdict.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 3
Montanalonewolf Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 6812
Joined: Mar. 2010
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 7:43 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Horse crap. People are just pissed because they didn't get the verdict they demanded after they insisted on a trial. The words "kangaroo court" come to mind for what they really wanted.

And it wouldn't matter if the jury did ignore instructions*, double jeopardy applies.

QUOTE
The Fifth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution provides, "No person shall … be subject for the same offence [sic] to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb." This provision, known as the Double Jeopardy Clause, prohibits state and federal governments from prosecuting individuals for the same crime on more than one occasion, or imposing more than one punishment for a single offense. Each of the 50 states offers similar protection through its own constitution, statutes, and Common Law.


*FIJA


--------------
If you are free to be a Liberal- Thank a person with a gun.

Those who don't read have no advantage over those who can't.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 4
gunslinger Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 6378
Joined: Mar. 2007
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 8:08 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Repealing stand your ground will embolden criminals IMO.

--------------
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 5
Bass Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 2118
Joined: Sep. 2006
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 8:10 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Montanalonewolf
QUOTE
And it wouldn't matter if the jury did ignore instructions*, double jeopardy applies.


Not exactly. As I have posted in previous posts, the US Constitution is just cleverly worded BS. Just look at the wording of your precious Second Amendment and try to legally own a gun in Chicago or DC. That should tell you how much your US Constitution means in the real world.

In the REAL world, this is what an article in the Mail today stated. From Justice Department :

Zimmerman was acquitted of murder and manslaughter on Sunday in a Florida courtroom, but civil rights violations provide an exception to the U.S. Constitution's protection against double jeopardy after a defendant has been found 'not guilty' in a state or local jurisdiction.

"Exception"? Sounds a lot like the many Second Amendment "exceptions" .....and many 4th Amendment "exceptions", etc. See the pattern? The document has so many "exceptions" as to be worthless in reality.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 6
markinOhio Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 590
Joined: Feb. 2005
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 9:48 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I will agree with Jackson!

Obama should offer some moral leadership. He is a Harvard grad, and you have to be pretty smart just to get into Harvard. He has a law degree, and should not have any problem digesting the evidence. So, with all the evidence presented, and the subsequent acquittal….what does he think about the case?

I think that it is a good opportunity for Obama to offer moral leadership via tough love:

1) Respect the verdict. The evidence not only raises a reasonable doubt about Zimmerman’s innocence, but also clearly indicates that he justifiably acted in self-defense.

2) Hit-up Jackson, Sharpton, and the NAACP to take some responsibility and help clean-up the house. Use some FBI crime data. Start with the overwhelming majority of homicide victims are killed by people of their own race and ethnicity (over 90% for African Americans). African Americans comprise 13% of the US population, but are responsible for around 50% of the homicides. Add in that there is a racial disparity among homicide victims killed by another race, but that disparity falls on the African American community (African American offender/ Caucasian victim is 2.5 times more likely (without correcting for population density) than the opposite). And, since they brought it up, hit them with the accurate Stand your ground data. Finally, let the country know that statistically when controlling for race/age/weapon type Martin was almost 7 times more likely to kill Zimmerman than the opposite.

This does not discount the racial prejudices faced by African Americans, nor does it discount the impact of those prejudices and socioeconomic factors on those crime statistics. It certainly does not dismiss true acts of racial violence. But, if we are going to have a discussion about race and violence, it should be an adult discussion based on facts. Not another discussion based solely on emotion.

However, I suspect that with Obama’s previous display of a racial bias, anti-gun/self-defense views, and Holders continued witch hunt, that is not exactly the way it would play out. If that is the case, I will at least give Obama credit for not (yet) adding to the emotional hysteria and misinformation by offering his “moral leadership”.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 7
rangersven Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 3537
Joined: Jul. 2002
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 10:21 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

There are many crimes when a defendant  can be charged and tried for the same offense.  Many state laws are also federal law violations -bank robbery is one example.

Holder is a real disgrace; he should be long one.  Not sure why HBO has not demanded his resignation yet.   Holder was tainted well before he became AG and was a poor choice for the position.

RS


--------------
"Backpacker.com's Original Provocateur"
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 8
Montanalonewolf Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 6812
Joined: Mar. 2010
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 10:50 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

BTW, 24 states have stand your ground laws and many others have the Castle Doctrine.

Jackson better just stay home if he's going to boycott all of them.


--------------
If you are free to be a Liberal- Thank a person with a gun.

Those who don't read have no advantage over those who can't.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 9
GaryP4321 Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 63
Joined: Apr. 2013
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 10:58 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

jessee jackson and all sharpton remind me of the kid who always cried wolf.

we are were we are today because the people cried wolf. then when it was found out there was no wolf they cried foul.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 10
TDale Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 14807
Joined: Jun. 2005
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 11:03 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

PLEASE boycott Florida.  While you're at it boycott Georgia.

--------------
"Sure as I know anything, I know this - they will try again...They'll swing back to the belief that they can make people... better. And I do not hold to that. So no more runnin'. I aim to misbehave."
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 11
Hiker01 Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 1117
Joined: Jun. 2006
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 19 2013, 11:06 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Do we really want the President of the United States to get involved in this?  I thought it was odd that he came out today and gave a speech about it, yet says nothing about what Chicago has turned into.  I heard Stevie Wonder was boycotting all the states with a stand your ground law?  When's the last time you listened to a full Stevie Wonder song? I'm sure those states are heartbroken.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 12
TDale Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 14807
Joined: Jun. 2005
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 20 2013, 12:56 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Hey, Stevie's got all the money he needs.

--------------
"Sure as I know anything, I know this - they will try again...They'll swing back to the belief that they can make people... better. And I do not hold to that. So no more runnin'. I aim to misbehave."
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 13
BillBab Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 5106
Joined: Sep. 2008
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 20 2013, 8:55 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Evidently , Charles Barkley and Bill Cosby are the only black folks that do not act like spoiled children when they do not get their way.

--------------
"Asking liberals where wages and prices come from is like asking six-year-olds where babies come from."

Thomas Sowell
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 14
OverUnder Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 260
Joined: Jan. 2008
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 22 2013, 5:28 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

If I didn't dislike humidity so much I would take all my vacations in Florida while the boycott was on.  At least I would know Jackson, Sharpton and their racist cronies wouldn't be there.

QUOTE
Evidently , Charles Barkley and Bill Cosby are the only black folks that do not act like spoiled children when they do not get their way.


And they get nothing but flak from the black community for speaking the truth.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 15
High_Sierra_Fan Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 42735
Joined: Aug. 2005
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 22 2013, 6:11 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(markinOhio @ Jul. 19 2013, 6:48 am)
QUOTE
I will agree with Jackson!

Obama should offer some moral leadership. He is a Harvard grad, and you have to be pretty smart just to get into Harvard. He has a law degree, and should not have any problem digesting the evidence. So, with all the evidence presented, and the subsequent acquittal….what does he think about the case?

I think that it is a good opportunity for Obama to offer moral leadership via tough love:

1) Respect the verdict. .....

You mean like this?
"The judge conducted the trial in a professional manner. The prosecution and the defense made their arguments. The juries were properly instructed that in a -- in a case such as this, reasonable doubt was relevant, and they rendered a verdict. And once the jury’s spoken, that’s how our system works."

With an ongoing Department of Justice enquiry dating from before the trial there's NO way the President can go beyond that.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 16
Raznation Search for posts by this member.
Why surf when you can make waves!
Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 24230
Joined: Sep. 2004
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 22 2013, 6:20 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE



--------------
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info WEB 
 Post Number: 17
nogods Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 6218
Joined: Sep. 2007
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 22 2013, 6:51 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Apparently people are tired of being helpless victims of crime.

QUOTE
Last month, the U.S. Census reported that Florida currently has the third-largest population growth of any state.

Last year, Atlas Van Lines reported Florida had 4,973 moves into the state, compared to 4,641 moves out.

And several demographers predict that within two or three years Florida could eclipse New York as the third most populous state in the country.


Population growth likely to push Florida past New York, experts say
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 18
Bass Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 2118
Joined: Sep. 2006
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 22 2013, 7:15 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(nogods @ Jul. 22 2013, 5:51 pm)
QUOTE
Apparently people are tired of being helpless victims of crime.

QUOTE
Last month, the U.S. Census reported that Florida currently has the third-largest population growth of any state.

Last year, Atlas Van Lines reported Florida had 4,973 moves into the state, compared to 4,641 moves out.

And several demographers predict that within two or three years Florida could eclipse New York as the third most populous state in the country.


Population growth likely to push Florida past New York, experts say

But with all the guns, the castle doctrine, stand your ground, and the self defense laws that allow someone to provoke a person to attack them and then claim self defense when they shoot them - I suspect that MORE people get killed than the net population increase that you quote.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 19
BillBab Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 5106
Joined: Sep. 2008
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 9:17 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Better boycott Chicago as well...since Illinois has the same law more or less

And guess who voted for it when he was a senator??

http://musing-minds.com/2013/07/23/im-sorry-dave-you-got-it-wrong/


--------------
"Asking liberals where wages and prices come from is like asking six-year-olds where babies come from."

Thomas Sowell
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 20
Raznation Search for posts by this member.
Why surf when you can make waves!
Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 24230
Joined: Sep. 2004
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 10:26 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(BillBab @ Jul. 23 2013, 8:17 am)
QUOTE
Better boycott Chicago as well...since Illinois has the same law more or less

And guess who voted for it when he was a senator??

http://musing-minds.com/2013/07/23/im-sorry-dave-you-got-it-wrong/

Thank you Ralph Wiggum

--------------
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info WEB 
 Post Number: 21
desert dweller Search for posts by this member.
Greetings
Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 9611
Joined: Feb. 2002
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 2:55 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

So far, these musicians have decided to join the boycott of Florida.

-Mary Mary
-Eddie Levert
-Rod Stewart
-Madonna
-Usher
-Pattie Labelle
-Kanye West
-Mary J
-Trey Songz
-Jay Z
-Rolling Stones
-Justin Timberlake
-R. Kelly
-Rihanna
-Alicia Keys
-Joe
-Will I AM
-Keyshia Cole
-Young Jeezy
-Erykah Badu
-Wale
-Frankie Beverly
-Parliament

Source.


--------------
Seek Higher Ground
Can you feel the silence


Photobucket
Flickr
YouTube
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 22
High_Sierra_Fan Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 42735
Joined: Aug. 2005
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 3:31 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Given the average age of Floridians is what, 110? The only ones of those who'll pinch are the Stones, Madonna and Stewart.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 23
Lamebeaver Search for posts by this member.
trail? I don't need no stinkin trail!
Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 18990
Joined: Aug. 2004
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 4:19 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Perhaps the fans of these musicians will be motivated to move to another state as a result of this action.

That would be like killing two birds with one rolling stone.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 24
High_Sierra_Fan Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 42735
Joined: Aug. 2005
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 4:34 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Dylan isn't on the list.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 25
nogods Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 6218
Joined: Sep. 2007
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 5:48 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Bass @ Jul. 22 2013, 7:15 pm)
QUOTE

(nogods @ Jul. 22 2013, 5:51 pm)
QUOTE
Apparently people are tired of being helpless victims of crime.

QUOTE
Last month, the U.S. Census reported that Florida currently has the third-largest population growth of any state.

Last year, Atlas Van Lines reported Florida had 4,973 moves into the state, compared to 4,641 moves out.

And several demographers predict that within two or three years Florida could eclipse New York as the third most populous state in the country.


Population growth likely to push Florida past New York, experts say

But with all the guns, the castle doctrine, stand your ground, and the self defense laws that allow someone to provoke a person to attack them and then claim self defense when they shoot them - I suspect that MORE people get killed than the net population increase that you quote.

If they are thugs like Martin, what's the problem?]

Just fewer thugs physically attacking law abiding people.

Maybe someday the Martins will learn that illegal violence isn't the answer to every issue they face.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 26
Bass Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 2118
Joined: Sep. 2006
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 6:36 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(BillBab @ Jul. 23 2013, 8:17 am)
QUOTE
Better boycott Chicago as well...since Illinois has the same law more or less

And guess who voted for it when he was a senator??

http://musing-minds.com/2013/07/23/im-sorry-dave-you-got-it-wrong/

Good link. Most people, including me, had no idea that Illinois is a SYG state!
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 27
Bass Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 2118
Joined: Sep. 2006
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 6:38 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

nogods
QUOTE
Maybe someday the Martins will learn that illegal violence isn't the answer to every issue they face.


Except that they are DEAD when they learn!
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 28
Ecocentric Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 4937
Joined: Jun. 2009
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 8:48 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Yep, killing more people will make everything better, except for that "justice" thing.

--------------
"Travel suggestions from strangers are like dancing lessons from God." -Kurt Vonnegut Jr.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 29
nogods Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 6218
Joined: Sep. 2007
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 8:54 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Bass @ Jul. 23 2013, 6:38 pm)
QUOTE
nogods
QUOTE
Maybe someday the Martins will learn that illegal violence isn't the answer to every issue they face.


Except that they are DEAD when they learn!

Let's see now...of the two people involved who would you rather see die ... the thug who uses illegal physical force upon the law abiding citizen or the law abiding citizen who is being beaten by the thug?

Perhaps his death will not go unnoticed by other criminals like him, and in essence his death will save some other would-be-thugs from the same fate.

So he may not have died in vain.  But he still died a common thug.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
 Post Number: 30
Montanalonewolf Search for posts by this member.

Avatar



Group: Members
Posts: 6812
Joined: Mar. 2010
PostIcon Posted on: Jul. 23 2013, 9:26 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE


(nogods @ Jul. 23 2013, 6:54 pm)
QUOTE
Let's see now...of the two people involved who would you rather see die ... the thug who uses illegal physical force upon the law abiding citizen or the law abiding citizen who is being beaten by the thug?

Bass has publicly stated multiple times that a victim has a civic duty to be beaten into a coma rather than use lethal force against an assailant.

--------------
If you are free to be a Liberal- Thank a person with a gun.

Those who don't read have no advantage over those who can't.
Offline
Top of Page Profile Contact Info 
33 replies since Jul. 19 2013, 7:25 am < Next Oldest | Next Newest >

[ Track This Topic :: Email This Topic :: Print this topic ]


Page 1 of 212>>
reply to topic new topic new poll

» Quick Reply Boycott Florida
iB Code Buttons
You are posting as:

Do you wish to enable your signature for this post?
Do you wish to enable emoticons for this post?
Track this topic
View All Emoticons
View iB Code



Get 2 FREE Trial Issues and 3 FREE GIFTS
Survival Skills 101 • Eat Better
The Best Trails in America
YES! Please send me my FREE trial issues of Backpacker
and my 3 FREE downloadable booklets.
Full Name:
City:
Address 1:
Zip Code:
State:
Address 2:
Email (required):
Free trial offer valid for US subscribers only. Canadian subscriptions | International subscriptions