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Topic: Obamacare Is Already Working!< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 27 2013, 1:04 pm  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Even as Ted Cruz tilts at the windmill of the ACA, it has won the day, though it is somewhat entertaining to see such childish, irrational actions from a guy who is obsessed with being a national political figure.


A telling iteration of the same delusion comes from Holman Jenkins’s column in The Wall Street Journal today. Jenkins writes about the second major goal of Obamacare, which was to slow cost inflation by transforming the medical system from paying for quantity to paying for quality. Jenkins is certain that this goal backfired as well. Obamacare, he writes, was “not reform—it was a piling on of subsidies that can only throw fuel on the fire of health-care inflation. Not even the usual mouthpieces pretend otherwise anymore.” Not only is Obamacare increasing medical inflation, but this fact is so obvious that not even “mouthpieces” for the law deny it!


In reality, the evidence on medical inflation to date has exceeded the most optimistic hopes of health reformers when the law passed. Medical inflation has slowed to the lowest rate in 50 years. The only argument is whether, or to what degree, Obamacare has helped drive this change (and, therefore, to what degree it will continue). The skeptics suggest the recession may have caused the slowdown — though, if that were true, it wouldn’t explain why Medicare, whose beneficiaries are insulated from the effects of the recession, would have lower utilization, Peter Orszag argues.


In any case, the usual mouthpieces are very much of the opinion that Obamacare’s numerous cost reforms are introducing more cost pressure into the system. They are joined by a growing list of disinterested experts, a few of whom I quoted in my print story on Obamacare:



"The ongoing slowdown in the health-care growth rate defies historical post-­recession patterns and is likely to be ­sustained,” concluded Price­water­house­Coopers in June. “It appears that the reforms will stick and health-care exchanges and other policies will bring competitive pressure to markets,” says Randall Ellis, a professor of health-care economics. “Although the proof for this point of view is not yet definitive,” reports the Health Affairs blog, “the depth and breadth of change suggest that significant transformation in the nation’s delivery system is under way.”


http://nymag.com/daily....er.html


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 27 2013, 11:20 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

And not a reply from the jingo Xenophobes.

Well......maybe they are...learning?

If so I will be crestfallen. I am not holding my breath.
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 6:45 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Granted it's a small sampling but regardless of what it's called, a larger percentage is against it than for it.

QUOTE
CNBC released its third-quarter All-America Economic Survey on Thursday, which included a question on support for President Barack Obama's signature legislation. Of the 812 individuals surveyed in the poll, half were asked if they support "Obamacare" while the other half were asked if they're behind the "Affordable Care Act."

CNBC found that when participants were asked about "Obamacare," more claimed they a) knew what the law was and b) did not support the legislation. In total, 29 percent of those polled were in favor of Obamacare, 46 percent were against, and 12 percent were unaware of what that was. On the flip side, when asked about the "Affordable Care Act," 22 percent supported the initiative, 37 percent were opposed to it, and 30 percent were unaware of what that was.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013....D383103


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 8:00 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Montanalonewolf @ Sep. 28 2013, 3:45 am)
QUOTE
Granted it's a small sampling but regardless of what it's called, a larger percentage is against it than for it.

QUOTE
CNBC released its third-quarter All-America Economic Survey on Thursday, which included a question on support for President Barack Obama's signature legislation. Of the 812 individuals surveyed in the poll, half were asked if they support "Obamacare" while the other half were asked if they're behind the "Affordable Care Act."

CNBC found that when participants were asked about "Obamacare," more claimed they a) knew what the law was and b) did not support the legislation. In total, 29 percent of those polled were in favor of Obamacare, 46 percent were against, and 12 percent were unaware of what that was. On the flip side, when asked about the "Affordable Care Act," 22 percent supported the initiative, 37 percent were opposed to it, and 30 percent were unaware of what that was.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013....D383103

Well what normal human bring wouldn't be against a law that requires government kill squads to roam the nation hunting out and murdering the the unproductive, such as Sarah Palin offered, her little son Trey?



Oh. Wait.

Funny thing, a slight majority is against "Obamacare" but a vast majority doesn't want the government shut down to get there and when asked about the specific features of "Obamacare" without using that label again a large majority want those items.
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 9:37 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

wwwest
QUOTE
http://nymag.com/daily....er.html


+1 .... Great link, great post.
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 11:53 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Montanalonewolf @ Sep. 28 2013, 3:45 am)
QUOTE
Granted it's a small sampling but regardless of what it's called, a larger percentage is against it than for it.

QUOTE
CNBC released its third-quarter All-America Economic Survey on Thursday, which included a question on support for President Barack Obama's signature legislation. Of the 812 individuals surveyed in the poll, half were asked if they support "Obamacare" while the other half were asked if they're behind the "Affordable Care Act."

CNBC found that when participants were asked about "Obamacare," more claimed they a) knew what the law was and b) did not support the legislation. In total, 29 percent of those polled were in favor of Obamacare, 46 percent were against, and 12 percent were unaware of what that was. On the flip side, when asked about the "Affordable Care Act," 22 percent supported the initiative, 37 percent were opposed to it, and 30 percent were unaware of what that was.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013....D383103

What I take away from those numbers are:

1) The general population is as uniformed on this issue as they are on most others.

2) The political propaganda machine has been effective at swaying peoples perceptions with misinformation.
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 12:37 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

All sadly true, but the good news is that come Tuesday real people with real needs will be signing up for Obamacare.

And that will be true even if, or maybe especially if, the Party of No shuts down the Federal government.  The state markets are not dependent on the Feds, and Obamacare is an essential service, so all the stupid posturing will only harm the national economy and will not stop Obamacare.

I swear that the Republicans really do have a negative learning curve!!

I thought you had to be insane for that to happen??  Oh, yeah, now it makes sense!

Maybe they could schedule a 45th vote to repeal Obamacare??  LOL

What a country!


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 1:17 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The Teaparty is a product of the plutocracy, but not entirely contollable by it. All the misinformation and Faux outrage they've been feeding the plebes the last few decades has become a rigid ideology with some genuinely batguano crazy demagogues in Congress.

Frankenstein wasn't able to control his monster either. The question is how much destruction will be wrought before the maniacs are subdued.


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 3:23 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(hbfa @ Sep. 28 2013, 9:53 am)
QUOTE
What I take away from those numbers are:

1) The general population is as uniformed on this issue as they are on most others.

2) The political propaganda machine has been effective at swaying peoples perceptions with misinformation.

From my view, the propaganda machine has been working overtime to convince those in favor with misinformation and and the naysayers are right.

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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 4:09 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

3 out 10 people don't even know what the ACA is!  How many of the remaining 7 do you think are actually informed naysayers?

I'll agree that this, like any political issue, is rife with rhetoric from all sides.  Yet the disparities in your numbers clearly show how misinformed the masses are.
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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 4:38 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

QUOTE
3 out 10 people don't even know what the ACA is!  How many of the remaining 7 do you think are actually informed naysayers

According to the left/ACA supporters, only "their" side has the correct information. I disagree.

The point was that a majority of those polled* were against Obamacare/ACA no matter which one it's called. You say that's because the naysayers are misled and misinformed. I say it's because they aren't.

Misinformation and propaganda come from all sides. The question would be which side receives less? You say yours. I say mine. And depending on one's opinion on socialism, we're both right and wrong.

*I'd say the "I don't know what it is" can be tossed from the sample because they'd have to be completely disconnected from the world not to have at least some idea.


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 5:20 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Montanalonewolf said
QUOTE

From my view, the propaganda machine has been working overtime to convince those in favor with misinformation
and and the naysayers are right.


oh really?  misinformation such as?

Montanalonewolf said
QUOTE

According to the left/ACA supporters, only "their" side has the correct information. I disagree.


well first of all the ACA was modeled after Republican ideas on healthcare.  Also those who
support the ACA aren't just on the left and conversely those who don't support the ACA also
do include some on the left who think it didn't go far enough and/or don't like the mandate
because it is a gift to the health insurance companies

Montanalonewolf said
QUOTE

The point was that a majority of those polled* were against Obamacare/ACA no matter which one
it's called. You say that's because the naysayers are misled and misinformed. I say it's because
they aren't.


So what you're essentially saying is one side says the other side is misinformed but the
other side says the same thing about the other side and so there is no way to objectively say
which one is truly misinformed? That truth is relative which of course it isn't?

Montanalonewolf said
QUOTE

Misinformation and propaganda come from all sides. The question would be which side receives less?
You say yours. I say mine. And depending on one's opinion on socialism, we're both right and wrong.


there it is again. One side says its the other side while the other side says its other side
and so there is no objective way to determine which side is misinformed. What nonsense.

Tell me which side believes there is death panels in the ACA? That has been your side that
has believed that nonsense. Do you think that whether the ACA has death panels is also
a matter of opinion and that can't be settled objectively too?

Which side believes the ACA was/is going to be a far leftists socialist government run/takeover
of healthcare? Your side does despite the fact that ACA, which I like to call  
ObamaRomneyHeritageFoundationCare for a very obvious reason, is modeled on past Republican
conservative ideas on healthcare. Do you think its matter of opinion whether in fact the ACA
id this leftists socialist government takeover of healthcare? The two premiere factchecking sites,
politifact and factcheck.org, both have said that its utterly false to declare that the ACA
is this far leftists  socialist government takeover of healthcare. In fact politifact called it
the "lie of the year" for 2010

Do you think politifact and facctcheck are leftist sources?

What about whether the ACA will cause higher deficits or not? Are there any neutral non-partisan
organizations that have looked into that question? Why yes there in which the most well known
is the Congressional Budget Office(CBO) and according to them repealing the ACA will
result in increasing  our deficits by 109 billion over 10 years  
.

So when your side claims the ACA will increase our deficts and contribute to adding to the national
debt, they don't know WTF they are talking about.

Here are 16 myths about the ACA according to politifact and only one of those comes from
the left


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 28 2013, 5:41 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

35,000 part-time Wal-Mart workers going back to full-time

http://www.forbes.com/sites....ter-all


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2013, 12:12 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Great article Tarol, thank you.

Who would have guessed that a well-staffed store filled with competent and reasonably paid employees might actually have an impact on the success of a company?

I am surprised that they have caved already, but not at all surprised that there share of retail business has been declining rapidly.  

This same pattern will be true for resaurants and fast food outlets that have tried the same loser strategy.  In the best of times they have a hard time keeping trained staff, and lately it has become impossible.

Very funny stuff, neh?


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2013, 11:12 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Montanalonewolf @ Sep. 28 2013, 1:38 pm)
QUOTE
According to the left/ACA supporters, only "their" side has the correct information. I disagree.

The point was that a majority of those polled* were against Obamacare/ACA no matter which one it's called. You say that's because the naysayers are misled and misinformed. I say it's because they aren't.

Misinformation and propaganda come from all sides. The question would be which side receives less? You say yours. I say mine. And depending on one's opinion on socialism, we're both right and wrong.

You're talking about two entirely different things here. The first is a question of fact (are the things people believe about Obamacare consistent with objectively verifiable reality?); the second is a question of ideology ("depending on one's opinion on socialism").

If I understand you correctly, your opposition to Obamacare is ideological in nature. You oppose it regardless of whether it reduces the deficit (which it does), reduces overall healthcare costs (which it does), covers many of the previously uninsured and uninsurable (which it does), or cuts insurance costs for most people (which it does), because you are ideologically opposed to any move toward "socialism".

That's fine as far as it goes...so long as you acknowledge that this is the basis of your opposition. But the facts are what they are, and don't depend on "one's opinion of socialism". People who think Obamacare increases the deficit or increases most people's insurance costs or has "death panels" or forces you to tell bureaucrats about your sex life or any of the other falsehoods being spread about the law are simply misinformed, regardless of whether one agrees with their ideological position.


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2013, 12:19 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

+1

Great post, on point at every step.

Latest scare tactic that the Party of NO is trying is a fear campaign claiming that the Federally funded health care counselors helping people to sort out and sign up for their best choice in the health insurance markets, are collecting personal information that may be exploited in some nefarious way.

The same information they have to provide every time they show up at the ER for medical attention that should have been taken care of by a primary care doc months or years prior, at much lower cost.

This fear campaign will be one more negative blip, but it won't derail the ACA from achieving its major goals.

What a country!


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PostIcon Posted on: Sep. 29 2013, 10:06 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE

I don't know if the author of this piece (or the Providence Journal he quotes)  is biased, but according to him, Mass. likes  RomneyCare.  They implemented RC, tried it, tweaked it, and now most are pretty happy with it.   

http://news.yahoo.com/romneyc....35.html

".....Mr. Romney signed the Massachusetts program into law in 2007. So seven years later, how has it done? More to the political point, what do people in the Bay State think of their health care insurance system – which, like Obamacare, includes an individual mandate requiring everyone to obtain coverage or face a fine and a marketplace where the uninsured can purchase coverage?

At first, there was a lot of skepticism in Massachusetts – from those on the right against “socialized medicine,” and from those on the left pushing for a single-payer system.

The Providence Journal next door in Rhode Island had this to say about Romneycare on its editorial page Sunday:

“The big difference between the programs is that the federal version puts more emphasis on controlling costs. That makes Obamacare arguably more conservative than the original Romneycare.

“For example, Obamacare proposes bundling payments for a medical condition. That means payment will be a set amount covering the soup-to-nuts treatment for an ailment, such as foot surgery. That removes incentives for ordering more tests or treatments than needed – while rewarding medical providers for doing a good job the first time around.

“It bears noting that Massachusetts is less generous in determining who gets subsidies. It helps pay for the coverage of those earning up to 300 percent of the federal poverty level. The federal government sets the limit for subsidies at up to 400 percent of the poverty level.”

So Obamacare is “more conservative” than Romneycare (at least in its original form), according to this analysis.
Romneycare got tweaked over the years, including in ways that control costs. As a result, the Providence newspaper points out, the fiscally conservative Massachusetts Taxpayers Foundation has called Romneycare “a well thought-out piece of legislation.”

“There’s a lot of wild accusations that the law is breaking the bank in Massachusetts, and that is simply not the case,” foundation president Michael Widmer told Forbes during the 2012 presidential campaign. “I think the state’s healthcare reform has been a huge success and is probably the best policy achievement in the last 25 years.”

A recent poll by the Massachusetts Medical Society, a statewide physician group, finds that most people in Massachusetts today are generally satisfied with the health care system there.

“Eighty-four percent of residents expressed satisfaction with the care they received over the last year, including 56 percent who indicated they are ‘very satisfied’ and 28 percent who are ‘somewhat satisfied,’” the survey report states. Seventy-three percent of residents reported that gaining access to health care they need is “not difficult,” and for serious medical problems, 86 percent said the amount of time they needed to wait was not a problem.

While no health care insurance system – private or public – is perfect, the bottom line in Massachusetts, as the Hill newspaper in Washington reported last month, is that “The vast majority of Massachusetts residents are satisfied with their healthcare under the state's 2006 reform law.”


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