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Topic: Grand Old Party & Grand New Party?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
 Post Number: 1
Crockett Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 04 2013, 10:42 pm  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Being Canadian and not claiming anything other than a basic understanding of the US political system, this polarization within the Republican Party seems pretty deep-seated.

Does anyone think this fracture may lead to a split of the GOP and a 3 party system?
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Montanalonewolf Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 04 2013, 10:54 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

We already technically have a multi-party system. The problem is the Gang Of 2 has a lock on the end results.

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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 04 2013, 11:07 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I don't think a functional mult-party system is possible without changing our voting process. Too many currently vote based on fear of the "other" guy winning, as opposed to the candidate they like the most. There are other systems we could use, but that kind of change is hard to do, at least in our country. Heck, we can't even decide to get rid of the penny even though that is less than worthless. We have not always used the current system of voting.
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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 05 2013, 3:22 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

"This polarization" was just as "deep seated" a few decades ago.  It's cyclic.  And each time the cycle comes around, a 3rd party rises up and makes a big splash, only to come crashing down when the cycle goes back the other direction.

"Third parties are like bees. Once they have stung, they die" -Richard Hofstetter

The only third pary candidate for president to get elected was Abraham Lincoln.  And by doing so the third party (Republican) rose to the top and the former number two (Whigs) dropped into obscurity, returning US politics to a defacto two party system.

Keep in mind that the US has a Presidential democracy and NOT a Parliamentary democracy like Canada and most European nations.   A Parliamentary government lends itself to multiple parties, with those multiple parties forming coalitions.  Such coalitions are (generally) not possible in a Presidential democracy, with the result being two very predominant parties.
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Drift Woody Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 05 2013, 8:07 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Crockett @ Oct. 04 2013, 9:42 pm)
QUOTE
Being Canadian and not claiming anything other than a basic understanding of the US political system, this polarization within the Republican Party seems pretty deep-seated.

Does anyone think this fracture may lead to a split of the GOP and a 3 party system?

A political party that simultaneously worships Jesus Christ and Ayn Rand is fundamentally schizophrenic.

It's a bizarre coalition of corporate shills, religious fanatics, and libertarians. Over the last several decades this has been crafted into a unified ideology that exists only to the extent that ignorant people can be persuaded to hold such dichotomous beliefs.

It was crafted by the real owners of this country who control big chunks of the corporate media. The ordinary folks who buy into this ideology have been manipulated by fear into believing their religion and their country are under assault from within by atheists, socialists, and immigrants.

When a mixed race president with a foreign name came into office at the height of the worst recession since the Great Depression he was a ready-made target for all the fear & hatred, and the Teaparty was born. It was created by the same monied interests that crafted the ideology, but it has taken on a life of its own and is largey out of control.

Although the radical Teaparty caucus is a minority among Republican House members, they exert undue influence because so many moderate Republicans are vulnerable in primary elections to extreme right candidates in gerrymandered congressional districts.

If the Republican Party did indeed splinter into two different parties, it would split the vote on the right and ensure a sweeping Democratic majority. House Speaker John Boehner is fully aware of this, and has the difficult task of appeasing the Teaparty nuts without driving out the moderates while trying to win back demographic blocks of voters the extreme right has alienated. The gerrymandered districts are the main reason Republicans control the House (D's received more total votes than R's in the last election) but it also eliminates the moderate politicians who otherwise would have to appeal to a more diverse constituency.

How this government shutdown and the looming battle over the debt ceiling play out -- and who the public primarily blames for the fiasco -- will go a long way in determining the outcome of the 2014 mid-term elections and the direction of our country.

The monied interests that created the Teaparty monstrosity are telling their shills in Washington to stop the nonsense and avoid the economic calamity, but if the GOP leadership alienates this monster it could be the death knell of their Party.

IMO that death would be well deserved, but I also think we need a responsible and enlightened conservative party as a counterweight to some of the impulses on the Left. A single-party system is not a good thing. Our Constitution was crafted with checks & balances for a reason.

But right now a fundamentally schizophrenic faction needs to be seriously checked. They are trying to extort concessions with the threat of economic calamity, and I do not believe for one second that method of governance is what our nation's Founders had in mind.


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We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children.
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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 05 2013, 10:22 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Both parties have extremist elements they can't afford to alienate entirely. But the extremist elements of the Republican party have grown so large they must play ball or implode. A three party system would result in a moderately liberal party vs. a conservative party vs an ultra right wing party. So the conservative vote would constantly be split, at which point the democrats could ignore the 5% extremist element they currently have to play ball with. Sounds like a win-win to me.
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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 05 2013, 11:51 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

We can only hope, but then we have the audacity of hope!

Great post Drift Woody, should be spread wide on the national media.


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"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness."

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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 06 2013, 8:03 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(wwwest @ Oct. 05 2013, 11:51 am)
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We can only hope, but then we have the audacity of hope!

Great post Drift Woody, should be spread wide on the national media.

+1

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Old Frank Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 07 2013, 10:48 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Jesus should have been a lawyer instead of a carpenter.

He would not have left so many loopholes in His most important command.


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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 09 2013, 6:15 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

'A political party that simultaneously worships Jesus Christ and Ayn Rand is fundamentally schizophrenic.'

OMG that was the funniest thing I have read in a week, and so true!

However, many Republicans don't know who Ayn Rand was, and they really don't know who Jesus Christ was either.

That is even funnier.
'
'It's Alabama Shrugged!
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Drift Woody Search for posts by this member.

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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 12 2013, 9:13 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(tamarac @ Oct. 09 2013, 5:15 pm)
QUOTE
'A political party that simultaneously worships Jesus Christ and Ayn Rand is fundamentally schizophrenic.'

OMG that was the funniest thing I have read in a week, and so true!

However, many Republicans don't know who Ayn Rand was, and they really don't know who Jesus Christ was either.

That is even funnier.
'
'It's Alabama Shrugged!

Many Republicans may not know who Ayn Rand is, but some of their leaders do:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XYw9RtDbU8


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We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors; we borrow it from our children.
-- Native American proverb
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PostIcon Posted on: Oct. 12 2013, 10:44 am Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE

Atlas Shrugged is 1100 pages long. I doubt many conservatives have read it, much less any of her other non-fiction books where she goes into detail about her hatred of religion.
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