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Topic: When did Nelson stop being a terrorist?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 2:15 pm  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

.....and why does ones criminal history not seem to matter, especially when atrocities continue to be waged against the same victims (white people in South Africa)?
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 2:32 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(pass-thru @ Dec. 07 2013, 1:15 pm)
QUOTE
.....and why does ones criminal history not seem to matter, especially when atrocities continue to be waged against the same victims (white people in South Africa)?

Dick Cheney, is that you??

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 2:52 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

pass-through

Ya I guess its just a coincidence that the right-wing used the "terrorist" label with respect to Mandela
over and over again and you just happening use that label in regard to Mandela?

Oh and I just love the phoney victimization making the whites out to be the victims when the blacks
were under apartheid for years

This is the same kind of upside down demagoguery that racists used to justify apartheid in South Africa
(everything from the charges that he was a terrorist to making the whites the victims)

BTW did you regard our founding fathers as terrorists?

So in your view Mandela was not a part of racial group being persecuted and fighting for their freedom
but was a terrorists?

Explain how the founding fathers were more justified fighting for their freedom compared to Mandela and
those he was fighting for


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 2:55 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

This meme seems to gaining traction. Do wing nuts ever have an original thought?
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 2:58 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

http://www.genocidewatch.org/southafrica.html

Did he or did he not target innocents?  Is that acceptable?  Did the founding fathers kill women and children?  Why did amnesty international refuse to intercede on his behalf?

If he's your hero, certainly you must be comfortable in your responses to these questions and not just brush them aside.  Or are you more less jumping on a bandwagon?

It is amazing what has happened to that country after the blacks took over.  The fields of murdered white farmers go fallow....why is that?  Are they not capable of simple agriculture?
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 2:58 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I suspect the French still consider Horatio Nelson a terrorist.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 3:19 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

pass-thru said
QUOTE

Did he or did he not target innocents?


target as in killing them in cold blood? show the proof with reliable proof

pass-thru said
QUOTE

Is that acceptable?


Is it acceptable when our country has killed innocents? How about when our American
troops and marines have raped and murdered innocents on occasion? Do you deny that?
Do we get to tar our troops and marines with the same brush you're attempting to
tar Mandela and the blacks in South Africa?

Of course in some of those conflicts, like in Vietnam and Iraq for example, there
was never ever an issue that were fighting for freedom except those who bought into
the propaganda used to sell those two wars.

pass-thru said
QUOTE

Did the founding fathers kill women and children?


Well what do think Native Americans would have to say about that?

pass-thru said
QUOTE

Why did amnesty international refuse to intercede on his behalf?


Why are you being selective?

pass-thru said
QUOTE

If he's your hero, certainly you must be comfortable in your responses to these questions and not just brush them aside.  
Or are you more less jumping on a bandwagon?


are you comfortable with the same questions in regard to Americas pasts? and speaking of bandwagon,
is it just a coincidence, once again, that you are repeating the same talking points and narratives
that the most vile right-wingers used to charge against Mandela?

pass-thru said
QUOTE

It is amazing what has happened to that country after the blacks took over.  The fields of murdered white farmers go fallow....why is that?  Are they not capable of

simple agriculture?


What a pathetic disgusting racist tripe. Ya racist. When you say something like
"It is amazing what has happened to that country after the blacks took over."

and

"Are they not capable of simple agriculture?"

WTF else could explain that kind of disgusting response?

I will call spade a spade.

oh and your link

it says
"News alerts, personal stories, and articles on South Africa can be sent to southafrica@genocidewatch.org."

I see lots of links about "White genocide" in South Africa but how much of that is true as opposed to propaganda?


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 3:27 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Dennis, please provide once example where an founding father killed an American Indian non-combatant.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 3:32 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Dennis The Menace @ Dec. 07 2013, 3:19 pm)
QUOTE
What a pathetic disgusting racist tripe. Ya racist. When you say something like
"It is amazing what has happened to that country after the blacks took over."

and

"Are they not capable of simple agriculture?"

WTF else could explain that kind of disgusting response?

I will call spade a spade.

oh and your link

I would expect no less of a knee jerk ad hominem from somebody of your intellectual depth.

That statement is actually based on a first hand account that I received from a black colleague of mine and a missionary from his church who has lived in South Africa for the last 30 years.  

We spoke at length concerning South Africa, the genocide and the aftermath.

Dozens of white farmers murdered everyday.  There fields go fallow.  No black agriculture.  Did he lie to me?  Is HE a racist?  

Apparently you can't handle truth....it doesn't fit in well with your fairy tale.   Anybody who speaks it must be racist.  
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 4:10 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

pass-thru said
QUOTE

Dennis, please provide once example where an founding father killed an American Indian non-combatant.


This is priceless

I specifically asked you, since you made the claim first, "target as in killing them in cold blood? show
the proof with reliable proof" and instead of answering that question you redirect to this question

I did numerous sources such as this one though


The founding fathers on that rock shared common characteristics. All four valued white supremacy and
promoted the extirpation of Indian society. The United States' founding fathers were staunchly anti-Indian
advocates in that at one time or another, all four provided for genocide against Indian peoples of this hemisphere.

George Washington...
In 1779, George Washington instructed Major General John Sullivan to attack Iroquois people. Washington
stated, "lay waste all the settlements around...that the country may not be merely overrun, but destroyed".
In the course of the carnage and annihilation of Indian people, Washington also instructed his general not
"listen to any overture of peace before the total ruin of their settlements is effected". (Stannard, David
E. AMERICAN HOLOCAUST. New York: Oxford University Press, 1992. pp. 118-121.)

In 1783, Washington's anti-Indian sentiments were apparent in his comparisons of Indians with wolves: "Both
being beast of prey, tho' they differ in shape", he said. George Washington's policies of extermination were
realized in his troops behaviors following a defeat. Troops would skin the bodies of Iroquois "from the hips
downward to make boot tops or leggings". Indians who survived the attacks later re-named the nation's first
president as "Town Destroyer". Approximately 28 of 30 Seneca towns had been destroyed within a five year period. (Ibid)

Thomas Jefferson...
In 1807, Thomas Jefferson instructed his War Department that, should any Indians resist against America stealing
Indian lands, the Indian resistance must be met with "the hatchet". Jefferson continued, "And...if ever we are
constrained to lift the hatchet against any tribe, " he wrote, "we will never lay it down till that tribe is
exterminated, or is driven beyond the Mississippi." Jefferson, the slave owner, continued, "in war, they will
kill some of us; we shall destroy all of them". (Ibid)

In 1812, Jefferson said that American was obliged to push the backward Indians "with the beasts of the forests
into the Stony Mountains". One year later Jefferson continued anti-Indian statements by adding that America must
"pursue [the Indians] to extermination, or drive them to new seats beyond our reach". (Ibid)

Abraham Lincoln...

In 1862, President Abraham Lincoln ordered the execution, by hanging, of 38 Dakota Sioux prisoners in Mankato,
Minnesota. Most of those executed were holy men or political leaders of their camps. None of them were responsible
for committing the crimes they were accused of. Coined as the Largest Mass Execution in U.S. History. (Brown, Dee.
BURY MY HEART AT WOUNDED KNEE. New York: Holt, Rinehart, Winston, 1970. pp. 59-61)


http://www.greatdreams.com/lies.htm


Now are you going to dodge my question with my redirection

pass-thru said
QUOTE

I would expect no less of a knee jerk ad hominem from somebody of your intellectual depth.


*rolls eyes*

As if you're even close to be discussing anything in any intellectual depth with me. Who here
wouldn't run circles around you intellectually(accept for a few who I think we all know about)?

witness your lack of self-awareness when you say "I would expect no less of a knee jerk"
when you're the same guy who said
"and why does ones criminal history not seem to matter, especially when atrocities continue
to be waged against the same victims (white people in South Africa)?"

and
"It is amazing what has happened to that country after the blacks took over.  The fields of murdered white farmers
go fallow....why is that?  Are they not capable of "

since when is the phrase "racist tripe" and ad hom when its applicable

and as far as your black colleague goes, since your using him/she as your anecdotal source,
please provide the person's full name, background and website to see how reliable this person is

and then provide other reliable sources to confirm this view


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 4:31 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The policy of the US towards Indians in the first decades of our nation was assimilation, followed by relocation.  Regrettably there were atrocities committed in some cases.  You cannot attribute those to the founding fathers.

However, crimes can be attributed to Nelson Mandela.

http://thebackbencher.co.uk/3-thing....mandela

If you want to verify/refute the first hand account that I received of South Africa, get off your lazy arse and look it up yourself.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 4:31 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Oh I found this which puts a little more context into some of pass-thru's claims


The South African farming community has suffered from attacks for many years.[1] Some sources have claimed
that  the majority of the attackers have been young blacks and that the majority of the victims have been
white Afrikaner farmers [2][3] but these claims have been disputed.[4] While the government has argued that
there is no evidence of organized attacks, white farmers believe these attacks are evidence of a campaign
to drive them off their land


&


Human Rights Watch criticized the government for placing too much emphasis on protecting farmers, at the
expense of protecting farm workers from abuse by farm owners. They suggest that "farm attacks" are given
a disproportionately high media and political focus. "Murders on farms (of owners, or of workers by owners)
are given an individual attention that some other killings are not."[9]


hence why I said
I see lots of links about "White genocide" in South Africa but how much of that is true as opposed to propaganda?

I'm also prone to be skeptical given specifically these claims are coming from someone with
the reputation of pass-thru


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 4:33 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(pass-thru @ Dec. 07 2013, 4:31 pm)
QUOTE
The policy of the US towards Indians in the first decades of our nation was assimilation, followed by relocation.  Regrettably there were atrocities committed in some cases.  You cannot attribute those to the founding fathers.


Excuse me did you NOT read what I quoted? IF you can attribute those things to Mandela then it seems we can
easily attribute those things to our founding fathers

pass-thru said
QUOTE

However, crimes can be attributed to Nelson Mandela.

http://thebackbencher.co.uk/3-thing....mandela

If you want to verify/refute the first hand account that I received of South Africa, get off your lazy arse and look it up yourself.

"lazy ass"

excuse me, that was YOUR PERSONAL SOURCE

You decided to use that person as a source therefore the burden is ON YOU to show who that person and the person's credibility


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 4:44 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(pass-thru @ Dec. 07 2013, 3:32 pm)
QUOTE

(Dennis The Menace @ Dec. 07 2013, 3:19 pm)
QUOTE
What a pathetic disgusting racist tripe. Ya racist. When you say something like
"It is amazing what has happened to that country after the blacks took over."

and

"Are they not capable of simple agriculture?"

WTF else could explain that kind of disgusting response?

I will call spade a spade.

oh and your link

I would expect no less of a knee jerk ad hominem from somebody of your intellectual depth.

That statement is actually based on a first hand account that I received from a black colleague of mine and a missionary from his church who has lived in South Africa for the last 30 years.  

We spoke at length concerning South Africa, the genocide and the aftermath.

Dozens of white farmers murdered everyday.  There fields go fallow.  No black agriculture.  Did he lie to me?  Is HE a racist?  

Apparently you can't handle truth....it doesn't fit in well with your fairy tale.   Anybody who speaks it must be racist.  

I believe that George Washington was the CinC of all Colonial troops, who killed a goodly number Tory civilians, including women and children, not to mention Native Americans, Plus Washington was a field commander in the French and Indian wars, and there was plenty of killing done at his command.  

It was war, and the founding fathers were certainly not exempt from reponsibility for killing a good number of innocents as part of that war.

Revolutionary war- around 147k civilians 70k soldiers(including only Americans(some were non-loyalist Canadians) and Katawapa and Leannape american supporting tribes) died.
The war of 1812- 35k civilians(only Americans) and 17k soldiers died.
Civil War- Union Soldiers- 505k Confederate Soldiers- 333k died
Union civilians- 500k Confederate civilians- Not known, but 387k might've died.


http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110619171854AA7XWco


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 4:46 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Dennis, you might look on youtube  for the video of Jacob Zuma singing "kill the farmer kill the boer" if you doubt the ANC's acquiesces  in the genocide.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 4:55 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Here's a good article that puts some of passT's cherry picking in perspective.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs....in-2008
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(HighGravity @ Dec. 07 2013, 4:55 pm)
QUOTE
Here's a good article that puts some of passT's cherry picking in perspective.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs....in-2008

LOL...I'm cherry picking?  I would rather say I'm merely pointing out the blemishes not considered by the cherry pickers.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 5:12 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(pass-thru @ Dec. 07 2013, 2:58 pm)
QUOTE
 Why did amnesty international refuse to intercede on his behalf?

This is a good example of your cherry picking. Amnesty International gave him the Ambassador of Conscience award.
And here is what they had to say about him

QUOTE
"As a world leader who refused to accept injustice, Nelson Mandela's courage helped change our entire world," said Salil Shetty, Secretary General of Amnesty International. "His death leaves a massive hole, not just in South Africa but around the world.

"Nelson Mandela's commitment to human rights was epitomised by his unswerving resolve to stamp out racial inequality during apartheid, followed by his vital work in combating HIV/AIDS in South Africa. His legacy across Africa, and the world, will stand for generations."

Nelson Mandela's life of political struggle and self-sacrifice stands as an example to millions around the globe. His grace under pressure, his courage and integrity and his commitment to healing and forgiveness over revenge and hatred was remarkable.

"One was struck by this man as being somebody quite outstanding," said Louis Blom-Cooper, who was involved in the foundation of Amnesty International in the early 1960s and was an observer at the long-running trial of Nelson Mandela and other anti-apartheid leaders on treason charges prior to their acquittal in March 1961.

"Literally, to face him and hear him speak, one felt one was in the presence of a very substantial individual who one day would become a very prominent citizen of South Africa.

"He had a very appealing face and when he spoke to you, you felt the most important person at that moment was yourself and not him."


http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/article....sty.htm

But you don't mention that do you? If you hate black people just say so. No need to do this little song and dance. You say enough other whacked out things it's not like anything else you say is going to make you look any worse.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 5:58 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Kanye West: A god among men:

"I am the next Nelson Mandela," West responded. "I'm only 36 years old, and when I look at everything I've accomplished, it's the only comparison that makes any sense. By the time I'm 95, I'm going to be a bigger hero than he ever was.

"Nelson Mandela did a lot of good work, don't get me wrong. But I think I'm on track to do something even bigger. I liberate minds with my music. That's more important than liberating a few people from apartheid or whatever.


"Not to say Mandela wasn't for real. I have mad respect. I just think we need to keep things in perspective here. Anyone can be replaced. And I think I'm well on my way towards being the next great black leader. I'm already worshiped around the world. And there's more to come."
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(HighGravity @ Dec. 07 2013, 5:12 pm)
QUOTE
But you don't mention that do you? If you hate black people just say so. No need to do this little song and dance. You say enough other whacked out things it's not like anything else you say is going to make you look any worse.

Why would I need to mention it?  What they do years later does not absolve their decision that his prison sentence was just.  Are they hypocrites?  Is he a terrorist?  Maybe both?  I don't care.  I don't have a position to defend because Mendela is not my hero.  

Regarding my view of black people....no I do not hate black people.  I have a number of respected colleagues and several friends that are black.  My first year out of college I worked in the inner city as a homeless prevention case worker, with the vast majority of my clients being black.  I sought the job out because service to community has always been important to me.  

However I do hate the victim mentality that seems to denominate much of black culture.
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(pass-thru @ Dec. 07 2013, 6:23 pm)
QUOTE
Why would I need to mention it?  What they do years later does not absolve their decision that his prison sentence was just.  

Perhaps you don't understand what cherry picking means. That's the only way that comment makes sense.

Mandela is currently dominating the front page of Amnesty International's web site.

QUOTE
However I do hate the victim mentality that seems to denominate much of black culture.


How about the victim mentality that dominates white conservatives?
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 9:28 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

denominate much of black culture.

Which denomination is that??


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 9:41 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

pass-thru said
QUOTE

regarding my view of black people....no I do not hate black people.  I have a number of respected colleagues
and several friends that are black.


OMG you actually went there(or a variation of it)

pass-thru said
QUOTE

Dennis, you might look on youtube  for the video of Jacob Zuma singing "kill the farmer kill the boer" if you
doubt the ANC's acquiesces  in the genocide.


What is it do you think we are debating?

whether there exist a video from some member of the ANC that has violent rhetoric? No were are not

You extrapolate what from this? From that video what do you think follows logically that is relevant and in
in question in our discussion?

Does it follow logically from that video that therefore there must be a genocide committed by blacks or more
specifically the ANC against Whites? Oh and on that question what would be the criteria for establishing a
'genocide'? How many  whites killed by blacks does it take for it to be considered a genocide or do demagogues
get to claim genocide regardless how many are actually killed?

OR maybe you think from that video it follows logically that Mandela must be a terrorist even though
that apparently Mandela helped avert a race war on 1993 after one of ANC's leaders was killed by
right-wing whites
?

or maybe you think it follows logically that this proves that our founding fathers didn't kill innocent
people including women and children even though it doesn't address the issue?

So these are the issues that are at issue here.

So with in mind lets go back to something you said

"I would expect no less of a knee jerk ad hominem from somebody of your intellectual depth. "

Yet you're the one that has such lack of intellectual depth that you're making incredible leaps of logic yet
the person you claim lacks intellectual depth is the one poking holes in your juvenile sophomoric logic.

You have self-awareness problems pass-thru


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 9:54 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

You know I wonder if the pass-thru's of the world showed even close to the outrage to some of the groups
our nation has financed over the years who had a lot of blood on their hands?  how about the Contras who we
funded. Who thinks they didn't kill innocent people? The right-wing called them "Freedom fighters".  CIA
coups in Chile, Guatemala and Iran.  Anyone think there wasn't any innocent blood shed in those coups? Our
.our own military has had some history of its own atrocities whether in Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam (Mai Lai)
or probably any number of other examples. Anyone think the pass-thru's of the world would show even close to
the same outrage against Mandela or the ANC?


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 10:01 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Funny Dennis, I don't remember claiming "outrage."  I was just curious whether those lauding Mendela also consider the atrocities.  There are many ways you could have responded thoughtfully, if not persuasively.  You chose the low road, again.

How many black folk do you know Dennis?  I'd be willing to wager a fair number of the do-gooders on here don't know any.  And have never had the pleasure of experiencing the 'tude first hand.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 10:14 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(pass-thru @ Dec. 07 2013, 10:01 pm)
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Funny Dennis, I don't remember claiming "outrage."  

LOL - Is that a joke? You reek of outrage. Why else would you start such an idiotic thread the day after he died? I'm starting to think you lost a girlfriend to a black guy.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 10:22 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

In response to the OP, the answer is 2008. This is per NBC news, not some right wing outfit. http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news....08?lite

but then again NSA considers us all to be potential terrorists


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 11:05 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Mandela never condoned (at least publicly) killing. His terrorist branch advocated sabotage, not murder.

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 11:43 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

pass-thru said
QUOTE

Funny Dennis, I don't remember claiming "outrage."  


I didn't say you explicitly said "outrage" did I?

Having said that what would be a better description for your responses such as


It is amazing what has happened to that country after the blacks took over.  The fields of murdered
white farmers go fallow....why is that?  Are they not capable of simple agriculture?



pass-thru said
QUOTE

I was just curious whether those lauding Mendela also consider the atrocities.  


There is no doubt that he engaged in armed conflict(whether that amounts to atrocities that could be
said he was responsible for I'm not sure. I would have to look into it more but given your reputation
I'm not going to take your word for it) but I was curious about your consistency and the fact you didn't
acknowledge our founding fathers having blood on their hands in the way I described, how you remain silent
when I remind you  about the atrocities of groups we have funded and atrocities from our own military kind
of speaks for itself doesn't it?  Now you say "I was just  curious whether those lauding Mendela also consider
the atrocities. "

pass-thru said
QUOTE

here are many ways you could have responded thoughtfully, if not persuasively.  You chose the low road, again.


Got tp love the projection. I specifically point out how you were NOT thoughtfull by poking holes in your
logic in regard to you using that video and then showing your low road comment to me was laughable and full
of irony and now according to you I've taken the "low road". Its that what you say when someone pokes so
many holes in something you say and have no response to it? Is that your way of trying to confuse people?

pass-thru said
QUOTE

How many black folk do you know Dennis?  I'd be willing to wager a fair number of the do-gooders on
here don't know any.  And have never had the pleasure of  experiencing the 'tude first hand.


Well if I told you you probably wouldn't believe me but is that the point anyway? Why do you think I linked to
that link anyway? Because its a common response from people who don't really care for black people so I
never use that response of how many blacks I know anyway as some kind of defense to show/prove I somehow
understand blacks or I'm not a racist bigot.

But the larger point is you have yet to refute anything I've said and have totally failed to show who
we have supported in the past(who has used violence to kill innocent people including women and children)
is less worthy  of outrage than violence committed by Mandela, how our founding fathers use of violence  
was less worthy of outrage  than any violence by Mandela or atrocities by our own troops(on occasion) is
less worthy of outrage than Mandela (assuming any atrocities can be attributed to Mandela).

What you have show you can do is recycle very common talking points the right-wing have used against Mandela
for decades.


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politics is the art of taking advantage of mass stupidity and ignorance
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 07 2013, 11:57 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE


(bill g @ Dec. 07 2013, 10:22 pm)
QUOTE
In response to the OP, the answer is 2008. This is per NBC news, not some right wing outfit. http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news....08?lite

but then again NSA considers us all to be potential terrorists

right-wing stuff? Its merely explaining the governments position about Mandela but on that note did the US
government ever consider the Contras, Anti-Semitic Hitler loving El Salvadorean death Squad leader Roberto
D'Aubuisson, Pinochet, etc "Terrorists"?

They didn't to my knowledge.

Why do you think that is?

Is it because they were less worthy of the "terrorist" label or is that the government use of that label
often is motivated by politics as in we aren't likely to use that phrase against groups that on our side
and more likely to use that label against groups that aren't friendly to us.

Here is a good example of this


Secretary of State Hillary Clinton is expected to notify Congress on Friday that she plans to take Iranian
exile group Mujahedin-e-Khalq, or MEK, off a State Department terror list, three senior Obama administration
officials told CNN.


http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2012....or-list

and I believe a similar thing happened during the Bush years with respect to Anti-Saddam Hussein
groups who were on the terror list only to be taken off it once the Iraq war started.


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politics is the art of taking advantage of mass stupidity and ignorance
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