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| Post Number: 31
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High_Sierra_Fan 
Group: Members
Posts: 39589
Joined: Aug. 2005
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Posted on: Oct. 19 2012, 4:15 pm |
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For anyone with a bleeding problem I'd suggest a saw is FAR easier to control than a hatchet. Though I'd agree that a simple stove would eliminate the issue anyway. Bears being irrelevant.
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| Post Number: 32
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JRinGeorgia
Group: Members
Posts: 298
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Oct. 19 2012, 8:47 pm |
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(UlightBandit @ Oct. 19 2012, 4:04 pm)
QUOTE I know cutting down dead trees might not be kosher, but if one is dead right beside a campsite, I don't see the harm.
A dead tree can stand for many years that can provide habitat for a variety of birds, mammals, reptiles, insects, plants, etc that rely on dead trees to survive. Just here in my home in suburbia we get chimney swifts every year because their natural habitat, hollowed out dead trees, has been completely cleared from what used to be woodlands. Without my chimney they would be SOL.
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- JRinGeorgia
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| Post Number: 33
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Drake
Group: Members
Posts: 1068
Joined: Jul. 2007
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Posted on: Oct. 19 2012, 10:25 pm |
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+1 on the Kabar Cutlass Machete as a woods tool. Kabar Cutlass Machete
It is a helluva lot more practical than a hatchet, and a lot safer too.
But it's worthless against bears.
Drake
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| Post Number: 34
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bigredd
Group: Members
Posts: 31
Joined: Sep. 2012
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Posted on: Oct. 19 2012, 11:09 pm |
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I might have to make a trip to Smoky Mtn Knife Works and look at the Kukri Machetes. I used a Silky Saw back when I had sufficient platelets and was always nikking my hands. Have yet to get cut with a knife or axe in the outdoors.
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| Post Number: 35
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rayestrella
Group: Members
Posts: 6411
Joined: Nov. 2004
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Posted on: Oct. 19 2012, 11:43 pm |
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Poor motor control? ;-)
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I measure happiness with an altimeter
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| Post Number: 36
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rorak
Group: Members
Posts: 175
Joined: Jul. 2012
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 12:43 am |
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I have a cold steel kukri and much prefer the KaBar Cutlas.
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Paul TC,MI.
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| Post Number: 37
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| Post Number: 38
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AlmostThere
I must not be there yet, I keep hiking...
Group: Members
Posts: 4890
Joined: Apr. 2008
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 10:15 am |
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There's a kind of disconnect here.
You only haven't had a problem with axes or knives til now.
Nothing says you won't have a problem tomorrow - and the problems you have after hitting yourself with a sharp thing you're swinging with force are going to make those nicks on the hands (even with the clotting problem) seem positively trivial. And swinging it around 10 miles from the car...
A large part of safety while backpacking is in mitigating risk and prevention. I'd really strongly encourage you to think about this a little more than you appear to be.
Does the need really truly outweigh the risks and the extra weight penalty in the pack?
Is the wood honestly so hard to break up that there MUST ABSOLUTELY be a sharp object at all?
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All truly great thoughts are conceived by walking.
Friedrich Nietzsche
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| Post Number: 39
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High_Sierra_Fan
Group: Members
Posts: 39589
Joined: Aug. 2005
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 11:27 am |
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Plan B? Get some Kevlar butchers gloves and use that saw. Lighter than any hatchet in combination with a small saw and useful for grabbing most anything with relative impunity.
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/ecatalog/N-1z0dxlx
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| Post Number: 40
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fmattos
Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: Aug. 2012
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 11:36 am |
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If in bear country, always carry bear spray, anything else will just be silly. If a bear is charging after you, I doubt you will be able to take that machete out and get a good swing at the bear before he is all over you.
I always carry a Frontiersman 9.2oz bear spray on one side of my hip, a multitool, and a Sog Fasthawk tomahawk on the other side, or hang it from my backpack. That tomahawk has awesome balance, weighs only 19oz, and I've used it to cut 8-9inch logs with it, took longer than I would've liked, but with a few hours of prepping I had enough firewood for a 5 days camp with spare.
That tomahawk makes it extremely easy to split smaller logs, cut kindling wood to the exact size you want, cut the bulkier 3-5 inch logs in minutes, and will still be sharp enough to shave marshmallow sticks. The other side has a spike that you can use for many things too. Hand saws are harder to maintain, easier to break, and good ones like the sven saws weigh about as much as the tomahawk.
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| Post Number: 41
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FamilyGuy
Group: Members
Posts: 5090
Joined: Jun. 2005
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 1:23 pm |
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(TrailTramper @ Oct. 20 2012, 9:50 am)
QUOTE
(UlightBandit @ Oct. 19 2012, 4:04 pm)
QUOTE I know cutting down dead trees might not be kosher, but if one is dead right beside a campsite, I don't see the harm. Widowmakers are known to end lives or break bones. . . . I collect branches & limbs that can easily be broken. This is really the opposite of "leave no trace" backpacking. You're saying that people have a right to reshape the wilderness according to their liking or convenience. I strongly disagree with that. Let nature take care of itself. Trees and branches will fall when they're ready. If you freel threatened by them, don't camp under them. Personally I don't enjoy a campsite where every single dead branch has been broken off the trees to a height of 7 feet. Convenient yes, but ugly and an unwanted reminder of human presence.
The only way to truly LNT is to stay at home.
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"This is your life and it's ending one minute at a time."
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| Post Number: 42
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bigredd
Group: Members
Posts: 31
Joined: Sep. 2012
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 4:23 pm |
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As a correction, I never cut myself while actually cutting with a silky saw; always when handling it or trying to clean debris from the irregular shaped pointy teeth.
The kukri seems to be the ultimate survival blade.
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| Post Number: 43
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Gabby
Group: Members
Posts: 5492
Joined: Jun. 2006
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 4:25 pm |
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Hatchets?
Machetes?
Kukris?
Okay, I know I use the word 'stupid' far too often, but...
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"I wouldn't even know how to begin to find the 'peyote lady', even if I thought it was possible in this incarnation...I'm completely tripped out on everyday life."
"By the way: where am I?"
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| Post Number: 44
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leadbelly2550
Group: Members
Posts: 1042
Joined: Apr. 2009
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Posted on: Oct. 20 2012, 6:52 pm |
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by the way, to answer the campfire question, they are only good when large enough to be viewed via satellite from space.....
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| Post Number: 45
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| Post Number: 46
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rodwha
Group: Members
Posts: 19
Joined: Aug. 2011
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Posted on: Nov. 14 2012, 10:18 am |
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I have been known to take along my Estwing No 1 from time to time. I've never used it for anything other than driving stakes though...
I doubt the OP was intending on attacking bears with a hatchet. Quite frankly I'd want to do something were I attacked.
Bear spray or a firearm would be much better. If/when we get the opportunity to do a month long backpacking trip down either the AT or CDT we will be getting some bear spray, and I will bring my .45 if the law allows. I would also take my hatchet, though I doubt I'd need it.
I've read of black bears attacking campers along the AT up north. I've heard that they realize backpackers carry food and will target your pack. I've heard many have lost their fear of man. And I've heard their population has exploded.
I don't want to be bear pooh, and would do whatever I could to prevent it.
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| Post Number: 47
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hikerjer
Group: Members
Posts: 9144
Joined: Apr. 2002
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Posted on: Nov. 14 2012, 10:29 am |
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Never carry one.
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"Too often I have met men who boast only of how many miles they've traveled and not of what they've seen." - Louis L'Amour
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| Post Number: 48
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Adirondackiteer
Group: Members
Posts: 419
Joined: Jun. 2010
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Posted on: Nov. 14 2012, 10:41 pm |
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I like my Fiskars X7, X27, and my K-Bar Becker BK-9 Bowie, and take them into the woods with me every time I go logging. Can't say that I'd ever bring them backpacking. I have brought a gerber folding saw before, and yeah tons of tiny sharp pointy teeth. Lots of way to clean the blade without touching it with your hands though, but if your that concerned you dont really need to clean it, next time you start sawing it should clean itself. But I rarely have fires, unless I am with someone who wants one just for the sake of camping. I'll carry a stove and thats good enough for me for food. If I were to head out into the woods to survive after an apocalypse or something like that, then perhaps I'd take it. But it would be a toss up between the hatchet or my K-Bar Bowie, and the Bowie probably would have more uses, but I give a slight edge of woodsplitting power to the hatchet. (But here is my K-Bar splitting a red oak round bigger around than my fist http://i903.photobucket.com/albums/ac235/kc2ebm/cpf/IMG_1133.jpg that was for a different discussion on a different forum though). For making kindling, the Becker is better (I heat with wood so I make a few 5 gallon pailfuls of kindling with the Becker each year). You could use the Bowie as a spearhead on a long stick, or as a drawshave, or probably even butcher an animal with it. But I doubt anyone on these forums will ever do any of these things in their entire life.
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| Post Number: 49
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TDale
Group: Members
Posts: 13153
Joined: Jun. 2005
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Posted on: Nov. 14 2012, 11:21 pm |
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to revisit this...
My favorite fires have been squaw fires. Fires so small i almost sat on them. Literally, I had a pile of sticks and a fire only a foot away. Anything going in the fire was breakable by hand.
The minimum fire you need is the best. You don't need a hatchet, axe, or saw for that.
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"Sure as I know anything, I know this - they will try again...They'll swing back to the belief that they can make people... better. And I do not hold to that. So no more runnin'. I aim to misbehave."
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| Post Number: 50
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KC8QVO
Group: Members
Posts: 588
Joined: Mar. 2008
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Posted on: Nov. 15 2012, 7:05 am |
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I will throw my 2 cents in here, if its worth that much. I have had a hatchet along on a trip with us, not mine and I didn't carry it, one of the other guys did. It was pretty much a waste to take.
That having been said, on another trip another guy had a fixed blade knife with him. He was able to split wood with it by beating the back of the knife and the tang to drive the blade through. With the right wood getting it to split a little at the top will let you pry it apart along the grain - and a fixed blade knife can be surprisingly effective.
I have a couple of Silky saws. I bought my first one after a recommendation here a couple years ago. I went with a Pocket Boy 170 at the time. It has been a very useful saw.
I know a lot of people don't like big wood being cut for camp fires, but my thought is the bigger the logs the longer the fire burns. One of the limitations with the Pocket Boy 170 saw is that it quickly runs out of room to cut. Anything bigger than about 2" is a challenge because you don't have room to run the blade back and forth. After about a year with the Pocket Boy 170 I bought a Gomboy 240 (I believe that is the size, I'll have to look at it again). This provides the room needed to get in to the 3-4" range logs and still experience effective cutting by having the room to run the saw back and forth through the log.
If you combine the versatility of a strong fixed blade knife with the cutting capacity of a saw you will have a nice camp set up.
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Steve
KC8QVO.com
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| Post Number: 51
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UlightBandit
ROAR!!!
Group: Members
Posts: 2394
Joined: Jun. 2008
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Posted on: Nov. 15 2012, 8:36 am |
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(JRinGeorgia @ Oct. 19 2012, 8:47 pm)
QUOTE
(UlightBandit @ Oct. 19 2012, 4:04 pm)
QUOTE I know cutting down dead trees might not be kosher, but if one is dead right beside a campsite, I don't see the harm. A dead tree can stand for many years that can provide habitat for a variety of birds, mammals, reptiles, insects, plants, etc that rely on dead trees to survive. Just here in my home in suburbia we get chimney swifts every year because their natural habitat, hollowed out dead trees, has been completely cleared from what used to be woodlands. Without my chimney they would be SOL.
QUOTE This is really the opposite of "leave no trace" backpacking. You're saying that people have a right to reshape the wilderness according to their liking or convenience. I strongly disagree with that. Let nature take care of itself. Trees and branches will fall when they're ready. If you freel threatened by them,don't camp under them. Personally I don't enjoy a campsite where every single dead branch has been broken off the trees to a height of 7 feet. Convenient yes, but ugly and an unwanted reminder of human presence.
Horrible how often things are taken out of context or important details in a quote are left out just for the purpose of silly argument.
My Original quote:
QUOTE I agree, but that is neither here nor there. I know cutting down dead trees might not be kosher, but if one is dead right beside a campsite, I don't see the harm. Widowmakers are known to end lives or break bones. I personally don't carry a hatchet, or chop down trees in the wilderness. I collect branches & limbs that can easily be broken.
Please note where I mention my personal practices.
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| Post Number: 52
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| Post Number: 53
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LiteMan
Group: Members
Posts: 241
Joined: May 2012
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Posted on: Nov. 19 2012, 12:51 pm |
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If you're dead set on having something to cut wood with, why not try something like the "Chain mate"
http://www.amazon.com/Chainma....2EDAUO2
It's pretty lightweight, pretty effective, and safer than a hatchet and a saw. It does need to be cleaned, but you could probably use some stiff brush to do so. I suggest reading all the reviews if you are interested in getting one, there are some good tips on there.
I have one, but don't bring it with me on hiking/camping trips, but have it for the SHTF gear bag-- if i ever have to live in the wilderness for an extended period of time. However, it's light and compact enough that unless you're an ultra lighter type, you could bring it and still sort of be "light".
Personally though, i recommend the small fire methods others have mentioned previously.
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| Post Number: 54
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Franco
Group: Members
Posts: 2706
Joined: Feb. 2005
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Posted on: Nov. 19 2012, 6:43 pm |
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Bigredd
If you really want to go the hatchet way, please also buy a GoPro camera because there are no YouTube clips (so far) of a bear vs hatchet fight.
On the other hand a workable and safe option is something like this :
(no it does not work with bears but it is only 6.7oz)
I have used the "chain saw" type, don't bother...
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| Post Number: 55
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mountaineer31
Group: Members
Posts: 3
Joined: Nov. 2012
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Posted on: Nov. 20 2012, 9:50 am |
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I would opt for a small folding saw such as a bahco laplander. You can process fire wood quickly with it and if you carry a full tang knife, you can use the knife to 'batton' the fire wood into smaller kindling.
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http://carpslife.blogspot.com/
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Survival Skills 101 • Eat Better
