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Topic: Consolidating The Management Of National Forests, ...< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 15 2012, 6:08 pm  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

This scares the hades out of me:

http://www.jhnewsandguide.com/article.php?art_id=9244


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 15 2012, 10:55 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Why?  The first I'd heard of this was an article in the local paper today, and now the article you linked.  I haven't thought about it enough to have an opinion yet.  What is your concern?

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trail? I don't need no stinkin trail!
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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 7:33 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The answer to "why" is easy......to save money.

Would it necessarily be a bad thing?  I'm not sure.
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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 8:27 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The Bridger-Teton is already the Second biggest in the 48 states and IMO is not adequately managed. When I was young almost all roads got graded and most of the inventory of trails got cleared. Now, not nearly as much. 3 of the 4 greatest Rivers of the American West have their headwaters on the BTNF. I think they need more, not less supervision. IMO its the same National Security concern it was during WW II when it was seriously patroled.

This would also likely be the nail in the coffin for the Forest Headquarters here in Jackson which I certainly would not like. That's a fair number of jobs for this town. Yeah, that's a bit selfish, I know, but we are what we are.

When we're continuing to spend more than the next 10 nations combined on our National Defense I see the neglect of our public lands at home as a serious NAtional, not just Regional defeat. Call it political if you want to, I'll respectfully  call it an appropriate rational prioty to do better, not worse, than we have when it comes to public lands management. When companies like Exxon-Mobil are making billions off of public lands can we not find a way to fund the management of them better?


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 9:40 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I'm sure the NFS would argue that consolidating supervisory functions would free more money for maintenance, etc. but I suspect instead of applying the savings to forest management, they would simply use it to prop up the teetering house of cards that is our federal budget.

I will refrain from commenting further, as that would clearly be in TPA territory.
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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 10:02 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I'm guilty of introducing politics but this being an "environmental" issue I say feel free to say what's on your mind LB.

Our budget can be reprioritized...if the citizenry demands it.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 2:25 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The citizenry is obviously more interested in subsidizing medicare, medicaid, student loans, mortgage tax breaks, social security, food stamps. the military, etc. etc. rather than conservation and preservation efforts.
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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 2:46 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

If they are anything like the forests I've been on, most of their money goes towards employees salaries - and very little to "discretionary" costs.

So, they'll talk about how they can perhaps close down a building or two, and how that could save some money - but that's not where the real savings would come - it would come from layoffs.  And most forests have already layed off and "reorganized" to the point that anymore and they wouldn't be able to function.  We're at that point right now.  Just trying to get the simplest of things done right now takes forever because there's no one left to do them...

But, yeah, this seems crazy - those two forests already were combined once upon a time, hence their hyphenated names.  

I don't think the federal deficit will shrink noticeably at all even if we halved the number of national forests by combining all of them two by two.  We need to address the big spenders - SS, Medicare, and Military - if we're going to make any noticeable difference.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 3:07 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Not going to make a dent in the price of one F-22 went for $137,000,000  or $600,000,000 each last year, depending on whose accounting you use.  

Might be good to leave public lands open at least for citizens to exercise, ... so our future pilots can actually fit into the cockpit.  Heck, give everyone who visits a trail a tax break.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 16 2012, 3:10 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Save the alpacas...

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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 18 2012, 10:54 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Another move to take Forest out of the Service. More GS-13's staring at screens and populating data to meet admin quotas.

In a wired age, I have worked in industry where they elimanated the much of equivalent of the Forest Supervisor staff and many of the Regional functions and decentralized decision making and implementation down down to the local stations and offices. Wasn't pretty with a lot of demotions and career' prematurely plateaued, but we had jobs and got it done quicker, smarter, and cheaper.

Hell, they could move the the survivors to D.C. and fly surplus drones....it is as close to the forest as they will get at the new mega Supervisor's office.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 19 2012, 8:55 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Yeah, good point, forests lay off from the ground up - so likely all the field-going personnel (boots on the ground) would be reduced to the point of laughability while the GS-11's and above stay put.

But the forests can take care of themselves, right?  If only people would do the right things in them.


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PostIcon Posted on: Nov. 19 2012, 11:15 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE

I would expect more closures and less local knowledge going into determining the least painful closures.  I would also expect less maintenance, especially to less popular facilities and trails.
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