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Topic: Mealworms could replace beef & Chicken< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 8:16 am  Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Now doesn't that sound tasty for folks that eat meat

No thanks


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 8:44 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Who sez we will run out of food.  Besides making meat-like products from bacteria in the lab, chefs have looked over other sources of protein.  According to the "food hacker", here is a cricket based protein bar at the bottom of the webpage

Food Hacking with Tim F (Outside)

The same webpage recommends preparing pigeon like dove or other squab.

An extensive search shows pigeon to have many English recipes.  Yummers.


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 8:47 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The researchers say this:
    “Since the population of our planet keeps growing, and the amount of land on this earth is limited, a more efficient, and more sustainable system of food production is needed,”
Why must we assume the population of our planet will keep growing? Is population curtailment such an impossibility? When do we take a sustainable population seriously?


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 8:52 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Travis that is a tough nut to crack. Here are the projections from one source



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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 8:54 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(TravisNWood @ Dec. 21 2012, 6:47 am)
QUOTE
The researchers say this:
    “Since the population of our planet keeps growing, and the amount of land on this earth is limited, a more efficient, and more sustainable system of food production is needed,”
Why must we assume the population of our planet will keep growing? Is population curtailment such an impossibility? When do we take a sustainable population seriously?

The US population alone is expected to increase about 55 million, with a 20 million increase in the SoCal area alone in the next 2 decades.

Gotta have something to put in all those fast food burgers and tacos.  The secret is in the sauce anyways...


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 9:25 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(eggs @ Dec. 21 2012, 6:52 am)
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Travis that is a tough nut to crack. Here are the projections from one source

I've seen that a hundred times over 50 years.

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 9:27 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Mealworms, the other white meat.....
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 9:29 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Odd how with the Great Recession we actually saw population growth level off or decrease in places. So it can be done.

The problem is a colossal failure of our society to recognize the benefits and to encourage a stable population.


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 9:37 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(TravisNWood @ Dec. 21 2012, 9:29 am)
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Odd how with the Great Recession we actually saw population growth level off or decrease in places. So it can be done.

The problem is a colossal failure of our society to recognize the benefits and to encourage a stable population.

First... shhhh... the gorilla in the room doesn't like it when you talk about him.

Second... America has a relatively stable population. The exponential increase in population will be derived mostly from developing nations, which we don't control.

Third... I wouldn't be surprised if those developing nations' birth rates significanty decrease as they develop. It's been shown that birth rates are inversely-proportional to wealth. Life expectancy on the other hand...

Fourth... I'd wager that a pandemic will "readjust" the human population before it reaches 10 billion.


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 9:47 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Yeah, and the scientists behind this project assumed a continued growing population. Wonder what they were thinking.

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 10:03 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Screw eating worms. Just give me soylent green.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 10:11 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Our leaders can't even balance a budget, you think they're willing to deal with the issues that would  come up with population stabilization?

It would take some sort or crisis......not that it won't happen someday...
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 10:13 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

They are inventing crises all the time - just waiting for us to bite.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 10:48 am Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

The problem with population growth is that it happens in 3rd world countries in most cases, where it cannot be supported, hence leading to famine, disease and war. Many European countries are actually loosing population - not enough children are being born each year.
And lets face something else: when countries try to limit population growth via laws it is never pretty and leads to an imbalance in gender.

And hey, nothing wrong with simply eating less meat overall ;-)


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 1:05 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Almost every society where inexpensive and reliable sources of birthcontrol becomes available to women, the growth of the population slows and/or levels off.  So part of this equation is fairly straight forward AND easy.  The problem to this part of the solution comes from opposition by "certain" religious orgs.  I won't name any, but they are easy to discover if one just thinks about it a bit, noting "certain" religious beliefs. One particular "saintly" religious figure in a high population area of the world fought very hard against making free and reliable birthcontrol available to the population, preferring to build a cult of suffering.  

Oops. have I gone TPA with this?  Frankly, I don't care.  Maybe it's just the mood I am in today.  Meanwhile ... pass the mealworms and the hot sauce.

Rumi


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 1:26 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Two thoughts:

1.  Even the grossest of ingredients, you can count on our agri and food processing industries to package them "nicely" for us.

2.  As for population growth -- poor families in poor countries have tons of children because it pays to have tons of children -- not because they don't have access to birth control.  Please get that one straight.   Children become productive from about the age of 6.  Only when a society progresses into middle class economic status will child rearing become expensive (think high school... and then even college) -- and parents adjust accordingly.

People used to think it was the pope who kept Spanish and Irish and Italian families large.  Since these Catholic countries have become richer -- pope or no pope -- they now have small families -- just like the rich countries before them.  In fact, these countries now have lower birth rates than the Scandinavian countries!

Watch.  India is getting (slowly) into middle class status.  'Sanjay and his family of nine kids' will become a thing of the past.  Too expensive!

And with China and India out of the way -- plus population stagnant or slowly declining in Europe and in the richer Asian nations (Japan, Taiwan, Korea, Singapore) -- world population should settle down nicely...


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 1:55 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Actually, there is the 1/10 rule, stating it takes ten times an animals weight in food to produce it's own size. So a 100 pound cow, eats 1000 pounds of grain to produce itself.
So, if you want to increase food available, just eliminate meat from the equation. Suddenly all that wasted food that went into producing the meat is available to others (ten times as much!). You have much more food to go around.
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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 1:55 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Wait...to be "healthy" I shouldn't eat grain-fed beef (supposed to feed them grass...and I'm o.k. with that) but I should now look to grain-fed mealworms as a solution to the "meat crisis"?

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 2:21 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Repeat and get this straight:  Everywhere inexpensive and reliable birth control is available to women, REGARDLESS OF ECONOMIC CIRCUMSTANCES, the birth rate declines.  The reason relative affluence causes drop in birth rate is because then birth control becomes affordable.  Whenever free reliable birth control becomes available to women in impoverished nations/regions, the birth rate drops.

The developed nations could help the undeveloped nations curb the birth rate if they helped provide free and reliable birth control.  But the efforts to do this is hindered by certain anti-birth control religions.  Cetain religious groups and organizations fight tooth and nail against making inexpensive and reliable birth control available.  One of these religious orgs actually enjoys city-state status.  

We may not be able to derail the mealworm protein train by providing free reliable birth control to all segments of the world population, but we can certainly slow it down.  I would like to enjoy a few more steaks before I kick the bucket.

Rumi


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 2:34 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(RumiDude @ Dec. 21 2012, 11:21 am)
QUOTE
Repeat and get this straight:  Everywhere inexpensive and reliable birth control is available to women, REGARDLESS OF ECONOMIC CIRCUMSTANCES, the birth rate declines.  The reason relative affluence causes drop in birth rate is because then birth control becomes affordable.  Whenever free reliable birth control becomes available to women in impoverished nations/regions, the birth rate drops.

The developed nations could help the undeveloped nations curb the birth rate if they helped provide free and reliable birth control.  But the efforts to do this is hindered by certain anti-birth control religions.  Cetain religious groups and organizations fight tooth and nail against making inexpensive and reliable birth control available.  One of these religious orgs actually enjoys city-state status.  

We may not be able to derail the mealworm protein train by providing free reliable birth control to all segments of the world population, but we can certainly slow it down.  I would like to enjoy a few more steaks before I kick the bucket.

Rumi

Rumi:

No, you've got the cart before the horse.

Sure, inexpensive -- or even better free -- contraceptives will get more usage than otherwise.  And you will see some decline.

But the decline I am talking about is not just families here and there -- but essentially the entire population of new or younger parents opting for less kids -- and sometimes even no kids at all!

Take India for example.  Cheap to free contraceptives have been available for decades now.  Back in the early 70's, the government there was so aggressively intent on controlling family size that they even sterilized people both by hook and by crook.  That drew such outcry that the government backed down.  Cheap and easy availability was simply not the issue.

And did India's family size drop dramatically in the 60s, 70s or even 80s?  No.  Only now, as people become richer, better educated, and have higher expectations of what child rearing should entail do they now have much smaller (2 kids) families in the cities -- but not yet in the countryside -- even though contraceptives are freely accessible there as well -- as they have been for decades now.  Why?  Because under the circumstances of subsistence farming... it pays to have lots of children helping out.


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 3:16 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(Lamebeaver @ Dec. 21 2012, 10:11 am)
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Our leaders can't even produce a budget, you think they're willing to deal with the issues that would  come up with population stabilization?

It would take some sort or crisis......not that it won't happen someday...

Ther, fixed it for you.

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 3:32 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

http://www.eastwestcenter.org/fileadmin/stored/pdfs/p&p015.pdf

https://scholarspace.manoa.hawaii.edu/bitstre....uence=1


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(RumiDude @ Dec. 21 2012, 12:32 pm)
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Exactly, Rumi!  And female literacy follows after a society lifts itself up from subsistence living.  The poorest don't go to school -- which is a big problem when you have a country where a vast majority is simply dirt poor.

Probably unlike you, I grew up in a poor, third world country back in the 60s and 70s -- and I remember what it was like:

Free primary school education.
Free contraceptives (plus LOUD government campaigns)

But the reality?

Contraceptives were used -- but not nearly often enough.  Hence the incessant campaigns over years and years.

Teachers in the rural area often spent the greater part of the morning's hunting down the children and "dragging" them back to the school house because illiterate parents didn't understand the big deal about education but needed those kids to work in the fields to bring in the family supper.  Which was why they had all those kids in the first place.

But when the country finally attracted some foreign companies to invest (what many of you Westerners like to dismissively refer to as 'sweatshops') -- some of the peasants found jobs in the cities and got small -- but regular -- pay checks for the first time in their lives.

It was these transported peasants who began to understand education -- and when they had kids of their own -- put them through school -- and bought them textbooks and even educational toys.  Suddenly, kids were costly rather than productive!  And parents began to have far fewer of them.  Contraceptives helped, of course, but they were used mostly when parents had already decided to have fewer kids -- not before.

And the cycle reinforced itself -- the parents acquired ever more skill sets so they could get better jobs -- the kids got better education as the country found more money -- until by and by -- the country became wealthy.

Religion?  Hardly.  It's economics.  Look back to our own history!  We Americans had tons of kids when we were an agrarian society.  Because kids helped support the family.  Not because the pope said so.


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 3:54 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

So what do you serve with mealworms?  A side of grasshopper-au gratin, cheesy termites, biscuits and centipede gravy, topped off with assorted spider pie?

Post yer favorite mealworm dish here!

Rumi


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(RumiDude @ Dec. 21 2012, 12:54 pm)
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So what do you serve with mealworms?  A side of grasshopper-au gratin, cheesy termites, biscuits and centipede gravy, topped off with assorted spider pie?

Post yer favorite mealworm dish here!

Rumi

Simple is best.  How about mealworm sashimi?  All you need is soy sauce -- and maybe some wasabe.   :)


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 4:12 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

Religion's role comes in the opposition it puts up to programs and orgs which wish to distribute free contraception and educate women about family planning.  Certian religious orgs continue to fight organization trying to distribute contraception and educate women about family planning.  Certain religious groups have fought behind the scenes, so to speak, against these family planning efforts by NGOs, hampering their efforts.

Whenever mothers are helped with knowledge of healthy practices which reduces child mortality so that women have arelative ssurance their children will live then they are more likely to use contraception.  This old canard about kids to work in the fields is silly.  We don't have to raise their standard of living first, we simply have to get women knowledge and reliable contraception. Reducing the size of families helps raise the standard of living. This has been demonstrated in Africa and Asia.

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 4:16 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE


(RumiDude @ Dec. 21 2012, 1:12 pm)
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Religion's role comes in the opposition it puts up to programs and orgs which wish to distribute free contraception and educate women about family planning.  Certian religious orgs continue to fight organization trying to distribute contraception and educate women about family planning.  Certain religious groups have fought behind the scenes, so to speak, against these family planning efforts by NGOs, hampering their efforts.

Whenever mothers are helped with knowledge of healthy practices which reduces child mortality so that women have arelative ssurance their children will live then they are more likely to use contraception.  This old canard about kids to work in the fields is silly.  We don't have to raise their standard of living first, we simply have to get women knowledge and reliable contraception. Reducing the size of families helps raise the standard of living. This has been demonstrated in Africa and Asia.

Rumi

Here, we take knowledge for granted.  But if you grew up in any of the poor, third world countries, you will learn that education comes mostly after a country has achieved some minimal level of economics.  And then the mutual reinforcing cycle begins.

I have spoken to a few sociologists (European) on some of my travels -- oh, the people you meet when on the road -- and they too agree that family size is mostly a matter of economics.  The pope fights behind the scenes everywhere -- but his success (and failure) just somehow correlate very, very closely to local economics.   :;):


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 4:34 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE



Just as a starter ...


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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 5:00 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic. Skip to the next post in this topic. Ignore posts   QUOTE

I think we should just agree to disagree.  We have mealworms that we need to start focusing on!  :D

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PostIcon Posted on: Dec. 21 2012, 5:09 pm Skip to the previous post in this topic.  Ignore posts   QUOTE

Can you get the free range version ?
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