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| Post Number: 1
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tarol 
Well I never!
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 10:01 am |
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Hiker Describes Hour-long Stare Down with Mountain Lion
by Outdoor Hub Reporters on February 21, 2013
A relaxing hike quickly took a turn for the worse when Dave Nash was confronted by a mountain lion last week.
The meeting was unexpected. The trail Nash favors near his Rocklin, California home isn’t usually known for cougar sightings, and he never felt threatened before. According to ABC News10, the only precaution he took was a flashlight that had a whistle attachment, something Nash grabbed on a whim. It may have very well saved his life.
Read more here:
http://www.outdoorhub.com/news....in-lion
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Got elevation? www.tarol.com
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| Post Number: 2
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ndwoods
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 11:36 am |
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Bummer they had to put the lion down....I wonder if the guy could have backed away or if the lion really was stalking him...hm....
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http://ndeewoods.blogspot.com/ and Wilder Ranch State Park
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| Post Number: 3
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ol-zeke
me in the Tetons
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 11:40 am |
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Sad ending to a mt. lion who developed predatory actions towards humans. Article says a F&G type shot the animal as it prepared to pounce on him.
I read a similar article in Arizona mag, several years ago now, with a happier ending and the standoff only lasted a few minutes, not in excess of 45. That incident involved someone more familiar with mt. lions.
All things considered, what an experience to have for the rest of your life? Face to face with a top of the chain predator. Not much could beat that, even with the fear thing.
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Everything I know, I learned by doing it wrong at least twice.
The easiest way to ruin a Friday is to realize it is only Tuesday.
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| Post Number: 4
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double cabin
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 12:34 pm |
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In 2002 I was driving from San Francisco to Denver the end of May and had a lion stalking around me cowboy camping with my jeep. I finally had to get some sleep so I gave it a rock barrage and it left the area.
I'm surprised this female had no kittens and exercised this behavior with a grown man. How small was this guy?
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We have nothing to fear but an industry of fear...and man skirts.
http://www.facebook.com/media/albums/?id=129511480442251
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| Post Number: 5
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TravisNWood
W Y O M I N G
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 12:40 pm |
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Regarding the OP, those are very unusual circumstances. They are interesting to read about, good to understand, but nothing much to be concerned about. Incidentally, what many people have confused with "stalking" has actually been merely the cat's curiosity. This case appears to have gone beyond that.
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Location — Wyoming
Webpages — Cloud Peak Wilderness Maps — Rocky Mountain Wildlife
Photos — Bighorn Mountains — Wyoming Steppes
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| Post Number: 6
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SW Mtn backpacker
Born to hike, forced to work ...
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 12:41 pm |
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Pretty close to the mountains surrounding Tahoe, so wonder if it was a juvenile cat, or possible rabid? Young mountain lions outside of California will even get into major Southwest suburbs and approach the inner city as local police usually need to put one down every couple years when they get trapped by traffic.
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Usually Southwest and then some.
In wildness is the preservation of the world. - Henry Thoreau
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| Post Number: 7
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tarol
Well I never!
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 1:26 pm |
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This encounter was interesting to me, as a very similar one was experienced by one of my former employees down in Cuyamaca State Park in San Diego County. There the lion stalked him for about an hour, and backtracking didn't work. My employee was about 5'10", thin build, and was carrying a day pack. After trying to walk back down the trail away from the lion, he basically started going bezerk, throwing anything he could at the lion without bending over too much, and making a racket. The lion finally left him.
Yeah, I guess these encounters are rare, but the lion population has exploded in this part of the world, and I hear these stories a lot (probably because of my occupation). I think a lot of the time the lions are fighting each other for territory and the food therein because I'm not sure there is enough anymore. Anyway, lions are the main reason I stopped hiking alone in areas where they frequent.
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Got elevation? www.tarol.com
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| Post Number: 8
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Ben2World
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 1:32 pm |
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Most animals developed a healthy fear of humans thanks to tens of thousands of years of continuous hunting. Not a hunter myself, but I do wonder if the significant decrease in hunting over the last couple of decades have caused current generations of predatory animals to lose their fear for us?
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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| Post Number: 9
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| Post Number: 10
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RumiDude
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 2:40 pm |
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Cougars were extirpated or nearly so in many areas due to habitat loss and hunting. There were bounties placed on cougars and many farmers, ranchers, and guides suplimented their income by hunting cougars. Conservationists helped abolish these bounties and severely reduces or eliminated hunting of cougars. Quietly the cougar population grew so that they outstripped their norman habitat and moved into closer contact with humans. In the meantime, human sprawl has carried people deeper into cougar habitat. This has invitably led to cougar/human conflicts as the article illustrates.
Rumi
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“This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all.”
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| Post Number: 11
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SW Mtn backpacker
Born to hike, forced to work ...
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 2:59 pm |
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(tarol @ Mar. 06 2013, 11:26 am)
QUOTE ... Anyway, lions are the main reason I stopped hiking alone in areas where they frequent.
Note to self: no trail-running in California mountains while wearing zebra-stripe Spandex.
Most articles I run into describe mountain bikers and trailrunners as most apt to trigger the big cat's predatory chase instincts. Chase implies from behind however. Sounds like the cat's in these instances faced off against humans out on a stroll (the law enforcement officer who took down the cat had a weapon but I doubt the cougar registered that as a threat). Wonder if a big pack and trekking poles would make them more wary.
(Ben2World @ Mar. 06 2013, 1:32 pm)
QUOTE Most animals developed a healthy fear of humans thanks to tens of thousands of years of continuous hunting. Not a hunter myself, but I do wonder if the significant decrease in hunting over the last couple of decades have caused current generations of predatory animals to lose their fear for us?
Ah, but would an animal remember a weapon or just that humans have flashy, noisy things that go "bang"? What is an animal's (especially but not exclusively) preception of "danger"?
The hunted animal is dead and doubt the cubs would survive much in the wild to propagate any sort of learned behavior. I'm thinking avoidance is more instinctual which may be overruled by hunger temporarily; some biology PhD is going to need to produce a controlled experiment to get definite answers.
The avoidance you and GS speak of just may be due to diminished numbers. Less predators/area = less chance of running into one.
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Usually Southwest and then some.
In wildness is the preservation of the world. - Henry Thoreau
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| Post Number: 12
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Ben2World
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 3:10 pm |
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(SW Mtn backpacker @ Mar. 06 2013, 11:59 am)
QUOTE
(Ben2World @ Mar. 06 2013, 1:32 pm)
QUOTE Most animals developed a healthy fear of humans thanks to tens of thousands of years of continuous hunting. Not a hunter myself, but I do wonder if the significant decrease in hunting over the last couple of decades have caused current generations of predatory animals to lose their fear for us? Ah, but would an animal remember a weapon or just that humans have flashy, noisy things that go "bang"? What is an animal's (especially but not exclusively) preception of "danger"? The hunted animal is dead and doubt the cubs would survive much in the wild to propagate any sort of learned behavior. I'm thinking avoidance is more instinctual which may be overruled by hunger temporarily; some biology PhD is going to need to produce a controlled experiment to get definite answers. The avoidance you and GS speak of just may be due to diminished numbers. Less predators/area = less chance of running into one.
Again, not that I really know, but I think when there is continuous hunting over generations -- adult animals will actively avoid humans and that gets passed on to the young -- along with knowledge re. choicer prey selection and requisite hunting skills.
Without hunting... adult animals wouldn't fear / actively avoid humans and would no longer pass that on to their young. One can imagine an interim period where these adults wouldn't treat us a food either (because they themselves weren't taught by their parents). But eventually, curiosity leads to contact -- and just like with tigers in India (where hunting is also forbidden) -- once the animals reacquire the experience of just how easy prey humans are -- that knowledge will be passed on...
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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| Post Number: 13
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hbfa
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 3:21 pm |
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Not far from there, a runner was killed by a mountain lion in 1994.
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| Post Number: 14
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| Post Number: 15
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RumiDude
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 3:48 pm |
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(SW Mtn backpacker @ Mar. 06 2013, 11:59 am)
QUOTE Ah, but would an animal remember a weapon or just that humans have flashy, noisy things that go "bang"? What is an animal's (especially but not exclusively) preception of "danger"?
The hunted animal is dead and doubt the cubs would survive much in the wild to propagate any sort of learned behavior. I'm thinking avoidance is more instinctual which may be overruled by hunger temporarily; some biology PhD is going to need to produce a controlled experiment to get definite answers.
The avoidance you and GS speak of just may be due to diminished numbers. Less predators/area = less chance of running into one.
Just like humans, there are fearful/shy and bold/curious animals. The bold/curious animals are the ones more likely to get killed by humans when there is any type of hunting. Without hunting, the bold/curious will not be selected out and thus more likely involved with human/cougar conflict. This applies to bears, coyotes, wolves, raccoons, etc.
Rumi
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“This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all.”
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| Post Number: 16
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Dave Senesac
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 4:11 pm |
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Yeah saw that on the news the other day. Hiking during day hours, I've always been more afraid of mountain lions than black bears. Lions tend to occupy lower elevations below summer hiking elevations and are more shy. A few years ago a photographer friend and I surprised two big cats that were less than ten feet away, above the McGee Creek Trailhead that made some news. Locally the huge Henry Coe State Park has many dense gnarly oak and chaparral forests areas their good population easily hides in along with deer to prey on. In the evening camping solo does creep me out there enough I'll bring along some flashing LEDs to set up around my camp in order to blink all night. A lion might see the LEDs and wonder if it could be a sign little green men landed again.
My suspicion is only solo hikers really need to worry. In my case with a usual big tripod in hand, I've hope that is also a strong deterent. A reason those in such a situation may be wise to look about for large sticks. And don't forget that cigaret lighter in your pocket capable of lighting the end of a big stick.
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...David
http://davidsenesac.com
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| Post Number: 17
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Woodswoman
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 6:28 pm |
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I'm certainly no expert on mountain lions, but I am thinking if the mountain lion wanted to eat that guy, there would not have been an hour-long stare down.
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"Ah, Colorado: the one place in America where people wake up earlier on weekends than workdays."
~Mark Obmascik
"In the high country that we love, trails are steep.
We climb each mile, breath by breath,
and at the threshold of pain, bliss overtakes us.
~Michael Hannon"
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Ben2World
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 9:01 pm |
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No, not Dave either.
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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RumiDude
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 9:03 pm |
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There are some times and places in LA which a person is probably more likely to encounter muggers and such, just as there are times and places a person is more likely to encounter a cougar in the wild. When I lived in the Detroit are, the downtown Reneisance Center was just about the safest area in the entire nation. But not far from there, it could get very dangerous, especially after dark. That someone would take appropriate precautions when in known cougar areas isn't a matter of surrendering to unreasonable fears, it's called being prudent. It is also what is is advised by many governmental agencies.
Rumi
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“This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all.”
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| Post Number: 26
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Ben2World
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 9:06 pm |
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Sure, Rumi, to take appropriate precautions. That I agree.
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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| Post Number: 27
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RumiDude
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 9:25 pm |
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Well the only person I can see who has stated she has changed her hiking is Tarol, saying "lions are the main reason I stopped hiking alone in areas where they frequent." That is exactly the advice given by many government agencies, including the one I cited.
If not Tarol, then who are you referencing?
Rumi
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“This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all.”
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| Post Number: 28
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Ben2World
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 10:50 pm |
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Government agencies, pffftt! They warn about real trouble spots alright, but entire realms too. Bureaucrats get into trouble for failure to warn. But few lose their jobs for casting too wide. And so they do.
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The world is a book and those who do not travel read only a page. -- St. Augustine
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RumiDude
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Posted on: Mar. 06 2013, 11:13 pm |
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Well who were you meaning in this thread in posts 20 and 23? Do you think Tarol is falling prey to unreasonable fear by changing her hiking practices as she stated? Do you think the advice to hike in groups in cougar territory is unwarranted? What other advice do they give which is unwarranted?
Rumi
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“This is my Indian summer ... I'm far more dangerous now, because I don't care at all.”
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| Post Number: 30
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Survival Skills 101 • Eat Better
